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Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
I mean you've painted yourself into a corner here, haven't you? We know from countries like India where very few people have been vaccinated that the delta variant is about twice as deadly as the most prevalent earlier strains, yet the death rate in the UK remains low even while daily new diagnoses climb north of 50,000.

The only difference between this wave and the previous waves is that most people are now vaccinated, including nearly all old or infirm people. Which flatly contradicts your ridiculous claim that vaccines offer only a marginal protection compared to the tiny risk of a fatal reaction to the vaccine itself.
 

mixed_biscuits

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Depends on the prevalence: if the virus is to infect 1 person but 70 million are vaccinated to prevent that infection obv more people will die from the vaccine than the solitary person saved by the vax campaign.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
You're right, the flu vaccines must distort flu severity
Not really, because most people don't get flu vaccines.

In any case, you're misrepresenting what vaccines do. They work by making you less likely to get the disease in the first place, rather than by lessening the severity of symptoms once you've caught it. The low death rate is a consequence of unvaccinated young people catching the virus, while the more vulnerable groups are all protected by now.
 

mixed_biscuits

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Whitty sez the vaxxed are 50% less likely to get infected.

The success criterion of most of the vaccines was diminished symptoms only.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
That's to do with the 'Number Needed To Vaccinate' - it's a thing; look it up!
Well 90% of the adult population has had at least one dose, so I have to wonder when exactly these hundreds of thousands of fatal vaccine reactions are supposed to happen.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
Natural immunity: original and best.
In the same way that the best protection from dying in a car accident is "being very lucky", rather than relying on seat belts, ABS, roadworthy tires, sobriety etc.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
If you'll believe that...
So go on walk me through this one. For me it's hard to know whether this will be good or bad the government cos
a) The health secretary has (allegedly!) caught covid just before we drop all restrictions. The first conclusion is "The government look like idiots and are pursuing a policy which endangers us all and they can't even keep themselves safe".
b) but he will presumably have it quite mildly as he is double-vaxxed and can point to how that is working I guess
c) but lots of people aren't double-vaxxed so that is not reassuring - in fact it's worrying for those who hoped the double-jab might make them immune
So... I don't see it, how does him getting covid help the government who are committed to their "freedom" policy on Monday? To me it makes that policy look even more dubious.
Or are you saying they want to change their mind but they don't dare do that without some kinda crazy development and this is it?
No, I don't get it at all.. for me it's not a major event, it's not gonna have any effect on policy or anything, it is basically just making Javid and the government look a bit stupid and giving everyone another laugh at their expense... or is that the trick, to disguise their evil behind laughable, lovable incompetence?
Be honest, do you just think it was a lie cos it was on the news?
I gotta admit that I am really confused by what your position is now.... something like "Covid is actually harmless BUT we are putting millions of lives at risk by not allowing the mass sale of banned cures which are in fact the only ways of combating this deadly and virulent disease - people were beginning to realise both of those truths at last but now Javid has conveniently got ill at the perfect time to blind people to both of them..."
 

mixed_biscuits

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Whereas the lockdowns were instituted with falling infections, this relaxation accompanies rising infections...it's meant to fail in order to reintroduce lockdowns; Javid's performance is merely to tell us that vax only do so much.
 

Leo

Well-known member
and I go back to the same question I've asked for the past 400 pages or so and is never answered (aside from some vague "oh FFS, Leo, open yr eyes!"): why would a government want to lock down their population? why would it want to stunt any chance of economic recovery (which is largely the only thing they really care about)?
 

mixed_biscuits

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They don't care about the economy; they care about instituting top-down global control to solve climate change (among other things).
 
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