The TIME Barrier.

craner

Beast of Burden
Hang on, he just said I was more stylized and self aware than Paglia (who I really like, as it goes). That's some of the highest praise he has ever given me!
 

luka

Well-known member
Hang on, he just said I was more stylized and self aware than Paglia (who I really like, as it goes). That's some of the highest praise he has ever given me!

im forever heaping praise on you! suprised you havent suffocated under it
 

luka

Well-known member
craner likes the doors. great band. jim morrison is a psychopomp. break on thru' is a nod to ezra pound. (just learned this)
 

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
This concept was hovering around me last night as I listened to jazz in the park

I started off with some john coltrane or something and it was very jazzy - and I realised that I couldn't hear that sort of jazzy jazz without being repelled by the kitsch that's accreted around it (through no fault of its own). That's a time barrier. Never such innocence again.

And the more out there experimental stuff, even, seems laughable because I'm aware of the stereotype of the self-indulgent jazz wanker, prodded into orgasm by the sound of a brass cat being strangled by a drum kit.

BUT the less jazzy jazz sounds the easier it is for my modern ears to swallow.

I'm sure many people have the same barrier with classical. It's kitsch to them, 'dentist's music' as Crowley said. I don't have that problem with classical music at all but I do have it with jazz.
 

mvuent

Void Dweller
that type of barrier experience sounds really similar to what version was talking about here.

maybe part of the reason it's hard to get over the goofiness of banjos etc. is that (I'm assuming, but maybe just protecting my own lack of knowledge) you're not very familiar with the idioms that it's used in? ime it's more common for people to criticize music for being corny or sounding like cartoon music, etc. when we don't understand its idiom very well--cause you recognize the idiom-signifying features but not the expressive twists and nuances. like how rap is often seen as a ridiculous, unintentionally funny genre by people who don't listen to it; they only pick up on the tropes they recognize from snl parodies of it.

(though like any sane person I agree about jazz either way)
 
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Corpsey

bandz ahoy
jazz before the 60's all sounds hokey. it only escapes that once the modality, atonality, suppressed harmonic function, etc. were introduced.

I see barry already covered this on page 1, I should have checked. However, I am more afflicted in the sense that I find post 60s jazz a bit hokey or pretentious or whatever. Not INTRINSICALLY. But to my ears. I probably already covered this myself but there are so many barriers. The limits of the self.
 

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
l
'how could they possibly have rapped like this:

well i'm rappingass robby and i'm here to say
i'm here to rock you party people to the break of day!

in those days? whereas now they, in so modern a style, rap like this:

percocet
molly percocet
chase a check
never chase a bitch

Didn't pick up here that the example of modern rap (however unrepresentative of all rap music now it might be) I picked reads like a tweet or a meme. In other words, the way language is being registered and used in 2019 has evolved and is reflected in this sort of rap music.
 

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
Been reading this thread and I feel ironically I'm just repeating what's already been said. But I'm glad I read it, it has its moments.
 
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