Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
You know when people say "the PM doesn't rule, actually billionaire businessmen do"? I guess Sunak decided to make sure and cover both bases.
I know he made a lot of money (by normal person standards*) in his own right as a hedgie, but most of 'his' money is actually his wife's, isn't it? On account of her dad being some multi-billionaire steel magnate or something?


edit: *not yours, of course, as Dissensus's very own Wolf of Wall Street
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
I know he made a lot of money (by normal person standards*) in his own right as a hedgie, but most of 'his' money is actually his wife's, isn't it? On account of her dad being some multi-billionaire steel magnate or something?


edit: *not yours, of course, as Dissensus's very own Wolf of Wall Street

I believe that his wife is the real billionaire yes.
 

shakahislop

Well-known member
i read on wikipedia that he / they are the 222nd richest people in the UK

most dissensus posters are still above them in that list obviously
 

luka

Well-known member
wearing a shirt tucked into blue denim, Seinfeld trainers and some shit sunglasses being well aggressive in defence of Elron Musk
 

shakahislop

Well-known member
Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi elites can be a total nightmare sometimes, in terms of thier attitudes to poorer people. Can have a proper born to rule flavour, no sense of the injustices of inequality, no qualms about humiliating subordinates in public etc. Sometimes it seems to me that some of those attitudes remain in like third generation south asians in the UK and the US, but these kinds of statements are always a bit shaky obviously coz I don't know many people that fit into that category.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
So Johnson is complaining about the shocking corruption in Starmer asking Sue Gray to come work for Labour... and honestly I'm not sure it was a great move. But next day, Johnson announces his honours nominees... including a certain Stanley Johnson, I mean come on.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
The sycophants supporting Johnson this week have been embarrassing at times... in fact all the time. When he - finally, way after it was due, and far too late for consideration if this were an actual court - produced his defence statement the party line was as crude as "This clearly demonstrates he did not mislead parliament" - in other words apparently, the right-wing "flog em and hang em, they're all at it, guilty til proven innocent types" are now adopting the stance, in fact more than that, are demanding that everyone take the stance that we should take the word of the accused as gospel.

If a defendant says that he is not guilty then that's it, he's not guilty. I'm one of those who is certainly happy for there to be quite a high barrier for prosecutors to clear when they are attempting to prove guilt. This is simply due to the principle that someone being mistakenly found guilty is worse than someone being wrongly let off, as the former in fact includes the latter ie if someone is wrongly convicted of a crime that they did not commit, then the guilty party has automatically been wrongly cleared. I suppose this is only the case in neat, idealized crimes with a single perpetrator, but the point that it should require a high standard of evidence and ultimately be a non-trivial challenge to convict someone of a crime remains - however even I would draw a line at saying that we accept the innocence of any defendant who says he didn't do it.

There is of course a particularly irritating circularity to that argument when the very question is "Is the defendant a liar?".

Johnson's supporters on Twitter etc are constantly trying to destroy the credibility of the court...

From The Guardian; In one heated set of exchanges, Johnson refused to explicitly disown supporters, who have called the committee “a kangaroo court”, arguing that the best way the MPs could prove their fairness would be to exonerate him of any wrongdoing. Footage of the session showed his lawyer, Lord Pannick, raising his eyebrows and shaking his head.

On this issue the people can really be divided into two groups; the first group being those who know Johnson deliberately misled parliament and are happy to say so, and the second group consisting of people who know Johnson deliberately misled parliament but who find it politically or otherwise expedient to pretend they think he didn't.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
Also from Guardian...

Johnson said: “I believe that if you study this evidence impartially, you will come to the conclusion that I have given.” He added that it would be “utterly insane” for him to have misled parliament...

I totally agree.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
So, apparently Johnson gave his diaries to lawyers who were preparing his defence for something or other, and on reading through the diaries they found evidence of him breaking more lockdown laws - and apparently they felt compelled to grass.

Boris Johnson has been referred to police by the Cabinet Office over claims that he broke lockdown rules by hosting family and friends at Chequers during Covid.
The visits to the former prime minister’s grace-and-favour residence were found in his official diary by his government-funded lawyers as they prepared his defence for the public inquiry into the pandemic.
They raised the issue with senior officials in the Cabinet Office, who then referred the matter to police as they were obliged to do under the civil service code, and also to the privileges committee, which is investigating whether Johnson lied to the Commons over Partygate.

That's a weird one. I would certainly have never expected this to happen, in fact I would have assumed that in such circumstances there would have been some kind of "lawyer-client confidentiality" type thing that would have protected him. But, sadly that appears to not be the case.

So it looks as though Johnson put the law in place, broke it on several occasions and then reported himself for doing so.
 

Slothrop

Tight but Polite
It's kinda hilarious how "personal responsibility" is this big underpinning idea of Tory ideology, but as soon as they actually start having to deal with the consequences of their own actions, they start whinging about how it's unfair and they're being victimized and it's all the fault of the "woke blob" and so on.

Also hilarious is that AIUI the latest thing with Johnson only came out because he was using public money to pay for government lawyers to try to get him out of the whole partygate thing, and hence the "client" was effectively the civil service and not Boris. If he'd actually forked out for his own lawyers then they'd have kept schtum about it.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
A lot of fuss being made about Johnson's resignation honours list, however it could have been worse

A casual bombshell buried in this BBC article. It’s both completely extraordinary and entirely on-brand that *eight* of Johnson’s proposed peers should have been rejected by a vetting panel that normally waves through PMs’ nominations without any problems

Extraordinary that somehow Johnson managed to pick EIGHT people who failed to clear a process that is usually a complete formality. The whole list hasn't leaked yet but I believe it contained Darius Guppy, Peter Sutcliffe, Vladimir Putin and Mixed Biscuits.
 

version

Well-known member
"Supporters of Boris Johnson have pledged to target both Conservative members of the privileges committee and Tory MPs who endorse its findings for deselection,"

You have to wonder whether any Tory who ever supported him acknowledges they were making a devil's bargain from the beginning. He was always going to go down in flames and try to take people with him. It's the same bargain the Republicans made with Trump.
 

Leo

Well-known member
"Supporters of Boris Johnson have pledged to target both Conservative members of the privileges committee and Tory MPs who endorse its findings for deselection,"

You have to wonder whether any Tory who ever supported him acknowledges they were making a devil's bargain from the beginning. He was always going to go down in flames and try to take people with him. It's the same bargain the Republicans made with Trump.

A difference being most Republicans in Congress have stuck by Trump, with many being very vocal about it. I get the sense more Tories have turned from Boris than support him.
 
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