Tricky vs. Goldie


  • Total voters
    20

thirdform

Well-known member
the choakhold strangles. that's the whole point. deconstructing would mean it leaves room and time for interpretation. you can't interpret someone who is strangling you!

In Thug, the voice is merely phatic not lyrical. whereas tricky attempts to achieve an avant-garde lyricism, but ends up resorting to traditionalism, albeit in a post-punk mould.

Tricky is Joy Division and the Fall. Young Thug is closer to D.A.F and Farley Jackmaster funk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqGx1WLWL9Q

However Farley still far excels Thug as he wasn't forced to appeal to the emo commentariat.
 

catalog

Well-known member
Asked my mate about this. He says:

"Tricky is probably better than Goldie but different animals so hard to compare IMHO."

Which I would agree with wholeheartedly
 

catalog

Well-known member
Just reading the Kodwo Eshun 'motion capture' interview by CCRU that @Matthew posted.

Tricky is mentioned, where he's talking about falling into small pieces of sound, the importance of the scratch etc:

"...in Abbaon Fat Tracks by TRicky, there's this woman who whispers to her kid 'Quick, quick, fly away, fast as you can to be with Jesus', she really whispers it. That whole sample must lasy, I dunno, 5, 7 seconds, 8 seconds, 11 seconds, but there's something so incredible about it. It abducts you so much, because you can hear an atmosphere in it, you can hear an ambience, you can hear levels of foreground within that sample. You can feel yourself getting abducted by it."


It's at about 42 seconds. I must've listened to this track hundreds of times and it definitely has an atmosphere as a whole, as all of Tricky does, but i can't say I ever noticed that specific whisper. But of course from now on, I'll hear it every time.
 

thirdform

Well-known member
Jungle would have still happened, possibly would have happened better, without Goldie
It would have happened without goldie sure. Better? only if you subtract all the reinforced crews. in which case you discount a lot of the mind warping darkside. It's easy to say metalheadz ruined jungle but it doesn't stand up to scrutiny - peshay, wax doctor, dj crystl, doc scott Photek etc all made impeccable darkside.

Auteur theory is silly, like in all things, but there's a danger of fetishising senius divorced from all contexts. People have to pay the bills! jungle was impossible for most of the UK to dance to in its original break exploitation form, hence the advent of jump up in 95-96. jj from deep inside the oldskool talks a bit about this on dogsonacid.

q: What's the difference between the mashed up ravers of 93 and the mashed up ravers of today? People were just as mashed up back in '93 when the music was much more broken up and break driven. So, how come the dancefloors weren't empty back then?

jj said:
Actually a lot of raves really struggled in terms of attendance in 93 as the music changed so quickly. If you ever get the chance to read the letter pages in magazines like Blaze and Eternity in 93 and early 94 you'll see that there were loads of complaints about the direction the music was going in and the lack of pianos. The fact is that a lot of the tunes LTJ Bukem was playing at this time were really not that popular and the same was true to a lesser extent for other DJs.

The big difference was that DJs like Bukem, Fabio, Grooverider, JJ Frost and a few others played tunes regardless of whether the crowd liked them (Grooverider got a lot of criticism for saying in an interview in 93 that he didn't play for the crowd). It's not as though tunes like Music, 19.5, Droppin Science Volume 1 (both sides), Heaven EP, Music Box etc. were really popular when they first started being played out in 93. It took a long time for these tunes to become widely accepted and the DJs that played them should get a lot of credit for that.
 

thirdform

Well-known member
often london is not Britain is remainer idealisation of UK being a superb anti-racist haven prior to 2015, but in the case of rave it makes much more sense. Yer average kid from Doncaster or Glasgow is more likely to be into eurohouse and happy hardcore.
 

catalog

Well-known member
i really wanna go out dancing, wouldn't even mind if it was happy hardcore at this point, even though i've never been a fan particularly.
 

thirdform

Well-known member
That's why Happy Hardcore came into existence.
Right it's impossible to understand jungle without the reggae, rare groove and jazz funk scenes that preceded it in London and to a lesser extent Bristol. Liverpool as well obviously but for whatever reason jungle never hugely took off over there even though there was a big black clubbing population.
 

catalog

Well-known member
I think Liverpool and also Manchester have always kinda denied their black music scenes. Not really very celebrated or talked about.
 

craner

Beast of Burden
Right it's impossible to understand jungle without the reggae, rare groove and jazz funk scenes that preceded it in London and to a lesser extent Bristol. Liverpool as well obviously but for whatever reason jungle never hugely took off over there even though there was a big black clubbing population.
Birmingham.
 
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