john eden

male pale and stale
Yeah I’m very impressed with team Starmer cloning an Uber Kieth as a bodyguard.

Less impressed with their ability to research which pub to go to for a photo op.
 

version

Well-known member
To be fair, the pub probably doesn't advertise on its site or whatever that the landlord's a right-wing nutter.
 

john eden

male pale and stale
To be fair, the pub probably doesn't advertise on its site or whatever that the landlord's a right-wing nutter.
No doubt.

Is it bad of me to hope that Keir was still mic-ed up on the way out for a proper Gordon Brown media meltdown moment?
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
I saw @craner posted something interesting on Twitter the other day showing that Blair is the only Labour leader since Wilson not only to have won an election, but to have got >50% of the working class vote - and also that Labour's share of the working class vote in 2017 was neither unusually high nor unusually low, in contradiction of claims sometimes made both by Corbyn's supporters and his detractors. (Then again, I don't know whether today's definition of "working class" is identical to, or even really compatible with, the definition used in 1974.)
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
I saw @craner posted something interesting on Twitter the other day showing that Blair is the only Labour leader since Wilson not only to have won an election, but to have got >50% of the working class vote - and also that Labour's share of the working class vote in 2017 was neither unusually high nor unusually low, in contradiction of claims sometimes made both by Corbyn's supporters and his detractors. (Then again, I don't know whether today's definition of "working class" is identical to, or even really compatible with, the definition used in 1974.)
So given that Callaghan lost, and Foot lost, and Kinnock lost (twice), and Brown lost, and Miliband lost, and Corbyn lost (twice), and, unless a miracle occurs in the next three years, Starmer will probably lose, maybe Labour's problems run deeper than who is leading the party at any given time, and whether they're from the centrist, soft-left or hard-left section of it.
 

WashYourHands

Well-known member
when you hover over the title and Keef's spud looms back, i didn't like that

Keef's kinks = coprophilia x 10, call to stool delay and denial, forced soiling and Bristol stool chart obsession, secretly delighted all the bog roll sold out last spring
 

subvert47

I don't fight, I run away
So given that Callaghan lost, and Foot lost, and Kinnock lost (twice), and Brown lost, and Miliband lost, and Corbyn lost (twice), and, unless a miracle occurs in the next three years, Starmer will probably lose, maybe Labour's problems run deeper than who is leading the party at any given time, and whether they're from the centrist, soft-left or hard-left section of it.

Without drawing any conclusions at all, the percentages of the vote (and distance from Tories) over the past 40+ years are interesting:

Blair (1997) 43.2% (+12.5)
Blair (2001) 40.7% (+9.0)
Corbyn (2017) 40.0% (-2.4)
Callaghan (1979) 36.9% (-7.0)
Blair (2005) 35.2% (+2.8)
Kinnock (1992) 34.4% (-7.5)
Corbyn (2019) 32.1% (-11.5)
Kinnock (1987) 30.8% (-11.4)
Miliband (2015) 30.4% (-6.5)
Brown (2010) 29.0% (-7.1)
Foot (1983) 27.6% (-14.8)

Starmer (2024) – I'd guess above Blair (2005) and possibly Callaghan. But he'll need to do better than Corbyn (2017) unless the LibDems make some sort of recovery (which isn't looking very likely).
 
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john eden

male pale and stale
Interesting to compare Corbyn and Foot. "Longest suicide note in history" etc.

Because that comparison was made by lots of people in terms of the politics/content, but the percentages are really different.

My impression is that what Foot was offering looked pretty terrible to most people compared to the dynamic optimism of Thatcherism. But maybe Corbyn didn't look that bad compared to what the Tories had to offer.
 
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