DannyL

Wild Horses
I don't know who but I thought I bet bloody one of them is on Dissensus.
Does it a bit of a disservice to call it alt-right (as per thread title) I guess.
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
Aha. Thank you. Would be quite interested in that course, I think, though don't have the bandwidth rn. The other guy does a podcast, listened to a few episodes. Quite reflective and enjoyable.
 

luka

Well-known member
a lot of it is predicated on aligning yourself with the 'active' forces of capitalism as against the 'reactive' forces that try to mitigate the effects of capitalism.
 

luka

Well-known member
a lot of it is predicated on aligning yourself with the 'active' forces of capitalism as against the 'reactive' forces that try to mitigate the effects of capitalism.

this is something they pick up from deleuze and delueze gets through nietzsche.
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
The idea of saying "well this is what we've got" about capitalism and recognising that every attempt to stop or reform it has been a dismal failure seems a realistic starting point at least. Idk about anything beyond that point.
 

luka

Well-known member
ah, i've got an interview with them somewhere. i'll try and find it. hopefully it wont take me more than 10 minutes....
 

luka

Well-known member
The idea of saying "well this is what we've got" about capitalism and recognising that every attempt to stop or reform it has been a dismal failure seems a realistic starting point at least. Idk about anything beyond that point.

thats not true is it. we stopped child labour in this country for instance.
 

luka

Well-known member
we got a 5 day, 40 hour week, albeit thats been eroded. theres workplace protections. there's unfiar dismisal laws. work safety laws. huge amount of reform which has saved lives.
 

version

Well-known member
this is something they pick up from deleuze and delueze gets through nietzsche.
So what is the solution? Which is the revolutionary path? Psychoanalysis is of little help, entertaining as it does the most intimate of relations with money, and recording—while refusing to recognize it—an entire system of economic-monetary dependences at the heart of the desire of every subject it treats. Psychoanalysis constitutes for its part a gigantic enterprise of absorption of surplus value. But which is the revolutionary path? Is there one?—To withdraw from the world market, as Samir Amin advises Third World countries to do, in a curious revival of the fascist "economic solution"? Or might it be to go in the opposite direction? To go still further, that is, in the movement of the market, of decoding and deterritorialization? For perhaps the flows are not yet deterritorialized enough, not decoded enough, from the viewpoint of a theory and a practice of a highly schizophrenic character. Not to withdraw from the process, but to go further, to accelerate the process," as Nietzsche put it: in this matter, the truth is that we haven't seen anything yet.

-- Deleuze & Guattari, Anti-Oedipus
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
we got a 5 day, 40 hour week, albeit thats been eroded. theres workplace protections. there's unfiar dismisal laws. work safety laws. huge amount of reform which has saved lives.
You'll turn into a soppy liberal if you carry on at this rate.
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
I did think some of that as I wrote, but the grand project of life outside capitalism has gone adrift. We can only have a slightly more reformed, less nasty, capitalism. I guess that's what Mark was writing about in Capitalist Realism.
 

luka

Well-known member

“Cyberpositive” was originally the title of an essay by Sadie Plant and Nick Land. First aired at the 1992 drug culture symposium Pharmakon, “Cyberpositive” was a gauntlet thrown down at the Left-wing orthodoxies that still dominate British academia. The term “cyberpositive” was a twist on Norbert Wierner's ideas of “negative feedback” (homeostasis), and “positive feedback” (runaway tendencies, vicious circles). Where the conservative Wiener valorized “negative feedback,” Plant/Land re-positivized positive feedback—specifically the tendency of market forces to generate disorder and destabilize control structures.

“It was pretty obvious that a theoretically Left-leaning critique could be maintained quite happily but it wasn't ever going to get anywhere,” says Plant. “If there was going to be scope for any kind of....not ‘resistance,’ but any kind of discrepancy in the global consensus, then it was going to have to come from somewhere else.” As well as Deleuze & Guattari, another crucial influences were neo-Deleuzian theorist Manuel De Landa's idea of “capitalism as the system of antimarkets.” Plant and the CCRU enthuse about bottom-up, grass-roots, self-organizing activity: street markets, “the frontier zones of capitalism,” what De Landa calls “meshwork,” as opposed to corporate, top-down capitalism. It all sounds quite jovial, the way CCRU describe it now—a bustling bazaar culture of trade and “cutting deals.” But “Cyberpositive” actually reads like a nihilistic paean to the “cyberpathology of markets,” celebrating capitalism as “a viral contagion” and declaring “everything cyberpositive is an enemy of mankind.” In Nick Land’s essays like “Machinic Desire” and “Meltdown,” the tone of morbid glee is intensified to an apocalyptic pitch. There seems to be a perverse and literally anti-humanist identification with the “dark will” of capital and technology, as it “rips up political cultures, deletes traditions, dissolves subjectivities.”

This gloating delight in capital's deterritorializing virulence is the CCRU’s reaction to the stuffy complacency of Left-wing academic thought. “There's definitely a strong alliance in the academy between anti-market ideas and completely scleroticised, institutionalized thought,” says CCRU's Mark Fisher. “It's obvious that capitalism isn’t going to be brought down by its contradictions. Nothing ever died of contradictions!” Exulting in capitalism's permanent “crisis mode,” CCRU believe in the strategic application of pressure to accelerate the tendencies towards chaos.
 
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