Are people reponsible for their actions

luka

Well-known member
Staff member
the only lads holidays ive been on is when me and jim go down to Barry to visit Craner and we all end up hating each other after the second night, its too punishing. pure banter bloodsport drinking from morning to night. no let up. no quarter asked, none given.
 

luka

Well-known member
Staff member
your kidneys ache. youre irritable and tired. overstretched. desperate for some kindness or some intelligent conversation but it is impossible. you have locked yourself into the banter zone death cage.
 

luka

Well-known member
Staff member
you wake up desperate for your own space. a little time to reflect and heal but its not available. the lads are already leering in your face, pouring a fizzy lager down your throat. demanding a wetherspoons breakfast.
 

luka

Well-known member
Staff member
you're not allowed to show weakness. it's just an ever escalating cycle of self destruction till someone cracks. a symbolic death. a symbolic murder.
blackout.
 

Corpsey

call me big papa
I'm not on a lads holiday btw it's me, two couples, and another singleton (f). It's a holiday for the remaining childless people in my london-centred friendship group. There is drinking but also a lot of lounging and reading. There have been moments of drunken ignominy but not as a general rule.
 

luka

Well-known member
Staff member
look a gift horse in the mouth

phrase of gift

  1. find fault with something that has been received as a gift or favour.
    "they did not look the gift horse in the mouth when the opportunity for victory presented itself"
 

thirdform

Well-known member
Responsibility is just a subjective value judgment, so people can be responsible for their actions whilst in reality they are wholly determined by an uncountable amount of variables. That is the problem with the free will vs determinism debate. It's not that we are drones, but the variables in day to day actions are near infinite and incalculable. So free will itself is a pseudo-problem for religious metaphysicians.

If you were clever enough you could probably get someone aquitted of murder though, a la Clarence Darrow.
 

craner

Beast of Burden
Responsibility is just a subjective value judgment, so people can be responsible for their actions whilst in reality they are wholly determined by an uncountable amount of variables. That is the problem with the free will vs determinism debate. It's not that we are drones, but the variables in day to day actions are near infinite and incalculable. So free will itself is a pseudo-problem for religious metaphysicians.

If you were clever enough you could probably get someone aquitted of murder though, a la Clarence Darrow.
In other words, chill about the cat.
 

constant escape

winter withered, warm
I don't think anyone can help what they do. It's a horrible belief that I can't rid myself of. I'd like to think people decided to be nice or not. But I don't really think if you decide to be nice you ever could have decided otherwise. But the one thing keeping me sane about this issue is that I'm a renowned idiot, too lazy to read and even to think, so there's a good chance I'm wrong. And even if I am right it doesn't really matter.

"Debates" are something I sometimes indulge in when wasted to try and prove I'm clever or something equally as pathetic. I thought it was cocaine that turned me into a pontificating windbag but turns out booze can do the trick just as effectively.
Not sure if you're looking for anyone to persuade you otherwise, but I'll take a crack.

Part of the reason I'm reluctant to admit/assert characteristics about myself (be they "renowned" or not), is that doing such tends to reinforce them, in a way. "Reification", no? By continuing to treat something abstract as if it were real/true, it becomes easier and and easier to treat that something as if it were real/true.

Instead, you can acknowledge the vagueness of your identity, and that the abstract stuff we are trying to articulate does not play by the rules of logic our articulation plays by. That is, you leave the matter undecided, "superpositional", instead of collapsing its flutteriness into a single point, a single answer.

This is kinda what schizoanalysis is, only applied to yourself. And this doesn;t mean you must resist picking up on patterns you exhibit in thought, or action more broadly - but it does mean that you stop there, that you acknowledge that habit as nothing more than a habit, rather than inducing that the habit is revelatory of your One true nature, your characteristic essence.

Maybe some of the above can provide an offramp, maybe not.
 

craner

Beast of Burden
Not sure if you're looking for anyone to persuade you otherwise, but I'll take a crack.

Part of the reason I'm reluctant to admit/assert characteristics about myself (be they "renowned" or not), is that doing such tends to reinforce them, in a way. "Reification", no? By continuing to treat something abstract as if it were real/true, it becomes easier and and easier to treat that something as if it were real/true.

Instead, you can acknowledge the vagueness of your identity, and that the abstract stuff we are trying to articulate does not play by the rules of logic our articulation plays by. That is, you leave the matter undecided, "superpositional", instead of collapsing its flutteriness into a single point, a single answer.

This is kinda what schizoanalysis is, only applied to yourself. And this doesn;t mean you must resist picking up on patterns you exhibit in thought, or action more broadly - but it does mean that you stop there, that you acknowledge that habit as nothing more than a habit, rather than inducing that the habit is revelatory of your One true nature, your characteristic essence.

Maybe some of the above can provide an offramp, maybe not.
I bet you wished you'd said that last night, Corpse. Maybe you can memorise it and then try to start the debate up again tonight.
 

craner

Beast of Burden
Like, "you know singleton (f), something you said last night got me thinking, part of the reason I'm reluctant to admit/assert characteristics about myself, etc. etc."
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
Staff member
Like, "you know singleton (f), something you said last night got me thinking, part of the reason I'm reluctant to admit/assert characteristics about myself, etc. etc."
I think "Oh god, take me now!" would be the only rational response she could make to that.
 
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