🌙 🦇 How Smoked Salmon is destroying our minds 🍣🧠

DannyL

Wild Horses
Sort of felt to me like a hit list of everything he despised - any rightly so in some cases - but laying into people for liking and enjoying celebs seems misguided. People enjoy escapism and gossip and to deny this seems a bit puritan. I felt a sense of real frustration from him with this video, it must be running up against the same sense of inevitable capitalist realism in the ecological sphere.
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
Just buying different stuff (or less stuff) won't resolve the alienation at the heart of capitalism, comrades. It IS the relationships that we build that can evolve into a way of realising our collective power though. So, that. But also cream cheese and salmon bagels.
Well put. Perhaps saying we want a new way of living, a new way of relating to each other might break the impasse a bit. That's where all this leads to, it seems to me.
 

john eden

male pale and stale
I think also having good relationships with all kinds of different people will break up the instafilter/beauty tyranny also. Not completely but the more you hang around with ordinary mates the more you appreciate different kinds of beauty I think and value more than looks. Fucking hippy that I am.
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
Staff member
I think also having good relationships with all kinds of different people will break up the instafilter/beauty tyranny also. Not completely but the more you hang around with ordinary mates the more you appreciate different kinds of beauty I think and value more than looks. Fucking hippy that I am.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure if someone stopped drooling over Instagram supermodels and started hanging around with us lot instead, it would recalibrate their beauty standards fairly sharpish.
 

suspended

Well-known member
First, this is obviously bad about the fish, the environment, the general patterns of destruction. "But what can we do?" Start by quitting meat if you are upset! Meat is economically inefficient, environmentally disastrous, and ethically horrific. It is a far, far larger contributor to the greenhouse effect than automobiles are, or Ethereum and NFTs, or plastic straws, or whatever libs are getting outraged about on Twitter this week.

Second, fetishizing dolphin and seal lives is the same hippie-dippie faux moralism thing as getting really upset about avocados while ignoring sweatshop socks. There are many smart, conscious animals that we eat without a second thought.

Some other thoughts: 1) Is it clear that consumerism, and not abstraction + distance + selfishness, is the primary culprit? Maybe consumerism just means those elements together, which brings me to... 2) Is it clear that the exact same unethical dynamics would not pop up under an alternate economic system? Capitalism is just human desire channeled; we don't want to feel bad about salmon so corps hide it from us. We want low prices so corps cut ethical corners. It's the same deal with blaming media—media shows us what we want to see. Don't blame the system when it's a species problem (and really, an evolved organism problem—nice altruistic ethics shouldn't really be expected to emerge given our biological background).
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
Staff member
First, this is obviously bad about the fish, the environment, the general patterns of destruction. "But what can we do?" Start by quitting meat if you are upset! Meat is economically inefficient, environmentally disastrous, and ethically horrific. It is a far, far larger contributor to the greenhouse effect than automobiles are, or Ethereum and NFTs, or plastic straws, or whatever libs are getting outraged about on Twitter this week.

Second, fetishizing dolphin and seal lives is the same hippie-dippie faux moralism thing as getting really upset about avocados while ignoring sweatshop socks. There are many smart, conscious animals that we eat without a second thought.

Some other thoughts: 1) Is it clear that consumerism, and not abstraction + distance + selfishness, is the primary culprit? Maybe consumerism just means those elements together, which brings me to... 2) Is it clear that the exact same unethical dynamics would not pop up under an alternate economic system? Capitalism is just human desire channeled; we don't want to feel bad about salmon so corps hide it from us. We want low prices so corps cut ethical corners. It's the same deal with blaming media—media shows us what we want to see. Don't blame the system when it's a species problem (and really, an evolved organism problem—nice altruistic ethics shouldn't really be expected to emerge given our biological background).
Eh, yes and no. It's true that animal husbandry is a major contributor to GHG emissions, but hardline pro-veganism arguments tend to assume "meat" is synonymous with "beef", whereas the emissions from poultry farming are almost negligible compared to beef.

Plus, if you're worried about eating intelligent animals, chickens are mind-bogglingly stupid.
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
Staff member
OK, somewhat flippant last comment there, and I buy free-range poultry and eggs myself whenever possible.
 

woops

is not like other people
Yeah, I'm pretty sure if someone stopped drooling over Instagram supermodels and started hanging around with us lot instead, it would recalibrate their beauty standards fairly sharpish.
@craner would have them looking through a different lens in no time
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
Staff member
@craner would have them looking through a different lens in no time
He'd cast his expert eye over some 19-year-old Brazilian bikini bombshell and be like, "Yeah, she's okay, but she doesn't hold a candle to Cindy Crawford in that shoulder-padded suit on the front of Harpers & Queen in April 1992."
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
Staff member
Literally whenever it is possible to buy it, or just when you feel like some?

Because one of those options sounds a bit excessive to me.
Ha, OK, you called my bluff. Let's say within the bounds of reasonable effort. So yes, if I'm shopping in the local butchers. Not so much if I'm making a long motorway journey and the best option for some protein and calories is KFC. (Not that that happens much these days, anyway.)
 
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