Everyone over 30 is racist

sufi

lala
it's a beautiful contradiction - if you deny your prejudices, then you are obviously a racist - the only acceptable position is to say yes but i'm doing my best to get over myself
such a lovely contradiction proves this is reality
 

sufi

lala
my friend, just post-50 returned to London to encounter a couple of twenty somethings were his new flat mates, they just casually tossed that line into the conversation like it's an established fact, and he's like when did this happen?

but tbh i quite agree
 

version

Well-known member
it's a beautiful contradiction - if you deny your prejudices, then you are obviously a racist - the only acceptable position is to say yes but i'm doing my best to get over myself
such a lovely contradiction proves this is reality
You can't ever get over them then. You've gone back to denying them the moment you think you've moved on and stopped being racist.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
my friend, just post-50 returned to London to encounter a couple of twenty somethings were his new flat mates, they just casually tossed that line into the conversation like it's an established fact, and he's like when did this happen?

but tbh i quite agree
Well, since you are practically goading us to ask - what did you do to be less racist today?
 

version

Well-known member
I mean it makes sense, but I'm also wary of working back from the answer you want and constructing a framework that only allows for that answer.

Also, there are plenty of people under 30 who will deny that they're racist and therefore flag themselves as racist.
 

boxedjoy

Well-known member
So many people instinctively react with horror upon being accused of bigotry and prejudice because we all like to think of ourselves as good people and it's natural to want to defend your own self-conceptualisation. Nobody sets out to be the villain in any story.

I wish there was a way to distinguish linguistically the difference between active racism ("I hate this person of a different colour because they are a different colour") and the way that people are unconsciously and unthinkingly racist ("I expect X because of stereotypes"). The overall effect is the same, really, and a difference in intent doesn't make it any fairer, or easier to accept, but I think it would go towards helping reduce that sense of personal offense and defensiveness in response to being challenged on it. "Micro-aggressions" I actually thought was a good term for this kind of thing but it's been turned into a punchline.

I get this a lot when I point out the casual and insiduous way homophobia can manifest itself in people's beliefs and actions - people are mortified by the idea that I would think of them as homophobes. But if they're open and willing to examine their own positions and change upon challenge, that's the part that lets you know where you stand with someone.
 

version

Well-known member
"Micro-aggressions" I actually thought was a good term for this kind of thing but it's been turned into a punchline.
I don't know how you avoid this. The moment you give something a name's the moment someone can misuse that name. There's also the additional problem of familiarity breeding apathy, ridicule etc.
 

boxedjoy

Well-known member
yeah you only have to look at the history of terms we used before "learning difficulties" to see how this plays out, time and time again.
 

version

Well-known member
So many people instinctively react with horror upon being accused of bigotry and prejudice because we all like to think of ourselves as good people and it's natural to want to defend your own self-conceptualisation. Nobody sets out to be the villain in any story.

I wish there was a way to distinguish linguistically the difference between active racism ("I hate this person of a different colour because they are a different colour") and the way that people are unconsciously and unthinkingly racist ("I expect X because of stereotypes"). The overall effect is the same, really, and a difference in intent doesn't make it any fairer, or easier to accept, but I think it would go towards helping reduce that sense of personal offense and defensiveness in response to being challenged on it. "Micro-aggressions" I actually thought was a good term for this kind of thing but it's been turned into a punchline.

I get this a lot when I point out the casual and insiduous way homophobia can manifest itself in people's beliefs and actions - people are mortified by the idea that I would think of them as homophobes. But if they're open and willing to examine their own positions and change upon challenge, that's the part that lets you know where you stand with someone.
This seems like it'd be particularly difficult in the current climate as people are terrified of being dragged on social media and don't trust others enough to put themselves out there like that.
 

boxedjoy

Well-known member
It's odd because I definitely think that, in everyday life, you actually earn more respect from people by admitting your weaknesses and mistakes and putting them right than you do by doubling down on them. Whether it's with friends or at work or whatever else, I've found that best thing you can do is put your hands up and take responsibility for your shortcomings. I don't get why, as a culture, we struggle so much with this.
 

version

Well-known member
It's odd because I definitely think that, in everyday life, you actually earn more respect from people by admitting your weaknesses and mistakes and putting them right than you do by doubling down on them. Whether it's with friends or at work or whatever else, I've found that best thing you can do is put your hands up and take responsibility for your shortcomings. I don't get why, as a culture, we struggle so much with this.
The media and social media loom over everyday life. You might be able to admit fault on a personal basis, but we spend more time than ever plugged into this vast, depersonalised network where the factors which encourage people to admit to and forgive mistakes - familiarity, regular face to face contact - just aren't there.
 

version

Well-known member
A complete and utter lack of responsibility is the optimal strategy in English politics atm too. The Tories have proven that. Never admit to or apologise for anything. The moment you do is the moment you open yourself up to taking serious damage.
 

sufi

lala
I wish there was a way to distinguish linguistically the difference between active racism ("I hate this person of a different colour because they are a different colour") and the way that people are unconsciously and unthinkingly racist ("I expect X because of stereotypes"). The overall effect is the same, really, and a difference in intent doesn't make it any fairer, or easier to accept, but I think it would go towards helping reduce that sense of personal offense and defensiveness in response to being challenged on it. "Micro-aggressions" I actually thought was a good term for this kind of thing but it's been turned into a punchline.
proportionality is important too - there's a difference between open racism (like that disgusting website) , and unintended micro-aggressions, between actions and talking shit
 

Leo

Well-known member
what does age 30 have to do with it? why do things change at that point? if people are racist at 40, chances are pretty good they were also that way at 20.
 

version

Well-known member
One of the obstacles with something like microaggressions is the same thing people run into when they tell people to be conscious of pronouns or not to eat meat. It's the making conscious of something previously unconscious, or at least done on autopilot, and the further complicating of an already stressful life.

It doesn't help that a lot of people are hearing this stuff via the blunt instruments of the media and social media and probably aren't that reflective in the first place.
 
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