IdleRich

IdleRich
The premiership is very strong now. In this round so far three teams from the prem have played, they have scored nine goals and conceded none and the three opposition teams - champions of Italy, France and Portugal - have managed a total of two shots on target between them in those three games. Now I'm sure that that record will not look so good after United play tomorrow and I'm not saying it's a certainty that a team from England will win the trophy, but it's clear that the league is way way stronger than any of the others. With the Spanish teams overstretching and their subsequent collapse (something that is hilarious in itself but disastrous for the competitiveness of the CL) it looks to me as though there are teams from the Prem that could conceivably win it than the rest of Europe can muster between them.

Question is how long this will last. PSG have the means to challenge them but making prestige signings such as the Messi one instead of smarter ones to get the players they need is holding them back. Bayern will be there or thereabouts of course but unless Real can bounce back - a distinct possibility of course and they are convinced they'll get Mbappe on a free at the end of this season - it looks as though we could be in for a period of premiership dominance.

I reckon Barca are properly fucked. My prediction is that for the next few years three out of four champions will be from England with Bayern getting the 4th in years when the English teams knock each other out and then slip up. I'm not really sure how I feel about that but it will piss a lot of people off.
 

luka

Well-known member
🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🦁🦁🦁
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
I did. It arrived just as my steak did. I thought that Utd had got away with it at first as it rolled along the line but the it nestled into the net...
 

Leo

Well-known member
Is Man U like our New York Yankees, a rich team that everyone else hates (and actually hasn't been that successful in recent years despite that ability to buy top talent, a bunch of uninspired millionaire players)?
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
Basically yeah. When I was young they were big but fairly mediocre until in the 90s Ferguson took over and after a couple more seasons of mediocrity he turned them into the best team in England and for approaching twenty years they were utterly dominant in English football - they won the league about fifteen times in that period as well as several FA cups and two Champions Leagues (plus several finals). Over this period he built a team and then as that one got old he built another and then another... and this is part of why he is seen as such a good manager. Also because in football the biggest predictor of where the team will finish in the league is the wage bill (not the transfer fees but the wage) and Ferguson's teams consistently placed above that more than any other manager.

Anyway, when he finally retired (after a couple of false almost retirements) there was a big thing about who would replace him and how they would maintain Utd's hegemony - and short answer is they haven't been able to, they have been through about five managers in the seven years (which in itself raises questions about short-termism, cos if that policy had been in place in 92 or whatever Fergie would have been fired before he became successful cos it took him a couple of years to win anything) since he left and spent more than a billion pounds but they have not been able to build a really good side. The thing is, for me, I remember when they were rubbish, but a lot of people only remember them as this utterly dominant force and expect that to be the natural way of things. I'm actually just grateful for the success that they did have, I think it's unrealistic to assume it will just continue that way. I almost feel that the natural state was the one when I was a kid and they have reverted to that at last.

But yeah they have always been hated and their long period of success added to that. They like to say that they are the most supported club in the world (not sure that that is true now) but along with that came a load of ABUs... Anyone But United and they love every embarrassing performance. In fact, the problem now is not that they are disastrously bad but that they are in a kind of purgatory which means they can be fourth or fifth in the league, get the odd good result where they beat Man City or Liverpool or something... but it's always a false dawn and after every good result they lose at home to Villa or something.
 

Leo

Well-known member
Some similarities to the NFL New England Patriots. I grew up there, and remember watching them when they were the worst team in football, there was a year when they won only one game all season. then they made some good trades and college draft picks, improved their record, got into the playoffs a few times. and then they drafted Tom Brady, went on to win six Super Bowls, and became the league's most hated team. and then Brady left, and they still decent but definitely rebuilding.
 

Leo

Well-known member
the difference between the Yankees and Patriots is the Patriots management are shrewd business people, always finding undervalued players and signing them to mid-level contracts and then often letting them leave a few years later when they become big stars and demand huge salaries. The Yankees, on the other hand, are like the lazy rich team that just goes out and pays top-dollar for big stars when they become available. they won some world series titles for awhile with that approach, but for the past 5-7 years or so they assembled a huge payroll of individual stars who don't necessarily gel as a good team.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
There is one thing though that complicates the hatred of United. You have these - let's call them - blue chip or old money super clubs of football which have been massive as long as I have been alive. In England you have Manchester United and Liverpool, but in Europe as a whole you have Bayern Munich and Real Madrid and Barcelona, there is Milan and Juventus and, well, you could argue who to include, possibly Ajax and Benfica and Inter or Arseanl or Tottenham. The exact make-up of this could be disputed cos Ajax and the Portuguese clubs which would have been on it twenty years ago no longer have the money to compete, but the point is that there is a kind of old guard, royalty whatever of football and their success has always bred resentment.

But, when considering these old money super clubs; rightly or wrongly, they are perceived to have won stuff and got money which they used to win more stuff and get more money. Forget the dodgy accounting and illegal support from the city at Real or the match-fixing and drugs in Italy or... whatever, that narrative is not purely true of any of those clubs. But, rightly or wrongly these mighty monoliths of the sport are considered to have, at some point, in some way, earned their place at the top table by winning stuff.

And then Roman Abramovich bought a second or third tier team (no disrespect intended here to anycunt who supports Chelsea - you cunt) and gave them what seemed like an insane amount of money to buy whoever they liked. And then suddenly, almost overnight, Chelsea were catapulted into this elite, not by training their players to perform beyond their skills, not by developing a radical new tactic that brought them victory and the money that came with that, not even by money-ball type shrewd investments in the transfer market - it was entirely because they had suddenly become the plaything of a dubious Russian billionaire (boo hiss) with loads of money to launder (allegedly) by buying loads of brilliant footballers and a hotshot manager calling himself The Special One (incidentally the last coach to lead a team from Portugal to win the highest trophy in football - so far at least, possibly ever).

So now, although everyone hated United, you always got this kind of caveat where people would sort of append to their insults to United something like "but at least they're not as bad as Chelsea cos they earned our hatred while Chelsea just bought it". And then things got even crazier/boringer depending on how you think, when Abu Dhabi and Qutar weighed into the fray by buying two more second or third tier type clubs (plenty of disrespect intended to anycunt who supports Man City or PSG), almost as if they had the express purpose of showing us what an insane amount of money REALLY was.

So now you have the old money blue blood clubs such as Real and Man Utd, enviously hated by all less successful clubs... and then the new money party crashers Chelsea, Manchester City and Paris Saint Germain who now have wealth to dwarf all the clubs previously considered giants and who are hated by pretty much everyone. Although most fans are secretly hoping that the Sultan of Brunei or Geoff Bezos suddenly decides that he really loves Swindon Town FC or whoever they trudge out to watch every Saturday...

So far despite their obscene wealth and glittering teamsheets neither PSG or City have yet managed to grab the main prize of the Champions League, which is a source of amusement for pretty much everyone. It seems like only a matter of time before City manage it though. PSG are arguably held back by the fact that they are in a weaker league and haven't found a way to step up from taking the piss out of the rest of their league (slight exaggeration in that they finished second last year) to suddenly facing Bayern or whoever, although maybe they will find the formula eventually.
 
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