Benny Bunter

Well-known member
I saw Asbo last night and he's got to be at least 25 ;)

lol

You just reminded me of yet another reason to whinge about post-dubstep. The MCs/hosts are always intolerably shit. Seriously has anyone ever heard a good mic-man over night-slugs type stuff, cos I haven't. And please don't say ASBO...
 

benjybars

village elder.
lol

You just reminded me of yet another reason to whinge about post-dubstep. The MCs/hosts are always intolerably shit. Seriously has anyone ever heard a good mic-man over night-slugs type stuff, cos I haven't. And please don't say ASBO...

nah Asbo's ok.

Chunky, on the other hand, is really very shit indeed.
 

wise

bare BARE BONES
I like Asbo on the radio he's quite funny, wouldn't really vote for him in a dance though
 

joe_muggs

Active member
Hello, this is fundamentally a non topic really, isn't it? False binaries everywhere.

I wrote this in the sleeve notes for the Hot Flush compilation:

As the wake of dubstep's dramatic push into the mainstream continues to stir up the waters of electronic club music, genre meltdown is all the rage. It's all “nu” this, “post” that and “future” the other, as a thousand hybrid sub-sub-genre names are pulled out of the air to try and sum up what is going on. And as often as not, key releases like Joy Orbison's 'Hyph Mngo' and Mount Kimbie's 'Crooks & Lovers' album are held up as somehow representative of this highly variegated zeitgeist.

What this last tendency fails to register, though, is that Joy Orbison and Mount Kimbie are just the latest of a long and distinguished line of individualist artists going right back to 2003 and the birth of dubstep who have been nurtured by the Hotflush label. Hotflush is an institution that was always just beyond or just outside dubstep, even as it released foundational tunes for the scene. From the very beginning in 2003, it brought out the fine detail of dubstep's mongrel nature, emphasising its kinship not just to garage, dub and techno, but to breaks, ambient and post-Aphex Twin electronica – different elements of these sounds coming together not into some homogeneous blur, but into unique, precisely-engineered structures.

There can be coherence in diversity, though. Core dubsteppers like Benga, Distance and Loefah, and maverick talents like Boxcutter, Pangaea and 2562 alike, have been able to come into the orbit of Hotflush and – despite the variety of their talents – contribute to a label aesthetic which sounds strikingly consistent from 2003 right through to the newly commissioned tracks from the likes of Roska and dBridge on this collection. It's a shadowy aesthetic, one that doesn't give up its secrets easily, full of hints and clues, often suggestive of deep reflection – yet always, whether its rhythms are that of dubstep, techno, garage, acid house or something more abstracted, rooted in the moving mass of bodies in dark clubs.

At the heart of all this is the main man, Paul Rose – Scuba. Not only has his own music embodied all of these influences and tendencies, but in his move to Berlin he helped define the Hotflush mentality – not abandoning the UK, but bringing it with him, injecting it right into the dark heart of Berlin's scene via his Sub:Stance nights at the infamous Berghain club. Again, the connections and cross-fertilisations are not vague things, random attempts to fuse “a little bit of everything, man”, but very precise realisations of what works together, based on one individual's real experiences in the world.

And that's what Hotflush is, pretty much. In the decentred, internationalist internet age where everyone's a freelance, marshalling so many individualist talents should result in a mess, a carcrash, a tower of Babel. But Hotflush remains living proof that clear vision and clear understanding of music and personalities can create from this myriad of voices and influences something that grows over time as a distinct and influential musical entity in its own right. Maybe the zeitgeist needs to catch up with that.
 

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
often suggestive of deep reflection:

I think this is true and also helps to explain why I find this music so boring. Like these artists have all studied all these different types of electronic music so deeply, selecting parts from each to make up their intricate, unique 'structures'. its almost like musicians acting like music critics.
 

gremino

Moster Sirphine
the reason why current productions and dj sets are so eclecticly all over the place, is propably that in last 20-30 years developments have been so fast that people are still digesting these many genres. + you have the internet overflowing things.

i think this post dubstep scene is just an intermediary ground for something bigger and far more powerful in the future... everyone's just finding their feet, it'll happen
yeah this is propably what happens. recently i'v thought that maybe i should just chill out (in terms of producing so intensively and worrying about current stuff not excatly being my type) and wait till this happens. kind of like waiting for that big wave on where you can surf :)
 

luka

Well-known member
its sad cos i am nominally from this group, just about, but middle class peopl will never make an interesting dance genre.
 

luka

Well-known member
also if joe muggs says somethig i disagree with it. probbaly hes a lovely bloke but i got no respct for him as a writer cos he tried to take it to reynolds. im defensive of reynolds. really and truly i am. reynolds invented dissenesus. he was the only thing kpunk and woebot had in commmon and they started disseneesus. he never taught me anything. i nevere learnt one thing from reynolds. i taught him more than he taught me but lets b honest he know about and was writing about nasty crew and dizzee before you had heard of them unless your name is luka, ach! or blackdown. cos i will credit martin h done som early thngs on wiley, he did know. big up yourslf martin. you did know.
 

muser

Well-known member
Shadowface said:
i think this post dubstep scene is just an intermediary ground for something bigger and far more powerful in the future... everyone's just finding their feet, it'll happen

or a more depressing/ less optimisitc view would be that one particular soundset will become popular and will claim the majority of the "scene", and the others will die out, ala wobble.

The whole thing is pretty different from dubstep in alot of ways but I could see this happening. There were alot of distinct subsets in early dubstep, with people subsequently latching on to different aspects. Early DMZ & Skull Disco verbed percussive stuff, Distance/ Vex'd/ pinchs War Dub grungey basslines, Hyperdub / Keysound dubbed out cityscapes, Rag & Bone stuff Toasty/Elemental etc etc. All got left by the wayside as far as "Dubstep" goes. But it all seems alot less cohesive then that time in dubstep, probably because there isnt really any specific unifying aesthetic. Defintiely alot less intersting or exciting as regards to following a musical lineage.

I guess another big difference is its all alot less serious aswell, which is maybe a good thing.
 
Last edited:

joe_muggs

Active member
I think this is true and also helps to explain why I find this music so boring. Like these artists have all studied all these different types of electronic music so deeply, selecting parts from each to make up their intricate, unique 'structures'. its almost like musicians acting like music critics.

That's an oddly anti-intellectual stance to take for a forum like this, and not what I was talking about anyway. I simply meant the music sounds like it was made by reflective people. And you know what, so is a lot of gonzo-sounding music. Iggy Pop is a reflective person too, and you can hear that in the Stooges. Gonzo vs reflective is another false binary, just as pernicious as "street" vs "intelligent" ever was. Tear-out vs emotional: false binary. Future vs retro: false binary. Punk vs soul: false binary. Current vs classic: false binary. So much of the discussion always seems to be about defining stuff by what it's not - which by definition involves the creation of a false binary.
 
Last edited:

luka

Well-known member
lets b actualy real, you will see me give a lot of cedit to tim finney. not becasu i think he is clevereer than me or that he has better taste than m, he doesnt. i stand alone, thats acknowledged fact, but becasue i know what he was writing at 19. when he was 19 he was writing at a level that jo muggs wioll nver touch. its a standard that as a music writere i rpbably couldnt touch even if i wanted to write about music. if you read finney then you know that. it was derivitaive obviously, tim knows he is a bit derivitive of reynolds but as a prose stylist finney was bettr at 19 than any of these dubstep apologists are at 30something.read k punks reviews in the latest issue of the wire, they are an object lesson in what not to do in music writing 2011. big up yourself muggs, but you havent done anything that made people pay attntion yet. play your position. reynolds thing on garagee in the wire was perfect. what th fuck have you done? boosterism. nothing more nothing less. i will say that. yeah i am drunk but i will some on here tomorrow and say the same thing sober.
 

luka

Well-known member
son, you are a mugg. nothing you hav written is worth reading. on a level, i wouldnt piss on you if you were burning.
 

luka

Well-known member
but if writing paens to m0sca pays your bills who am i to judg you. we all hav to make a living.
 

rumble

Well-known member
That's an oddly anti-intellectual stance

Gonzo vs reflective is another false binary, just as pernicious as "street" vs "intelligent" ever was. Tear-out vs emotional: false binary. Future vs retro: false binary. Punk vs soul: false binary. Current vs classic: false binary. So much of the discussion always seems to be about defining stuff by what it's not - which by definition involves the creation of a false binary.

Does not compute
 
Top