Gang of 4 were shit. Discuss.

[Corpsey.]

I liked this, it was very idiosyncratic.

does abwarts have hardcore stuff Im not aware of or does @Matthew have explaining to do?

 

[luka]

I'm not into rock but that mix made me decide the 80s was the best decade for rock. Having said that it's got some of the worst music I've ever heard in my life on it. No exaggeration. Things that have to be heard to be believed. I highly recommend it.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

I'm going to need some expanding here

Leo + version have basically covered Gang of Four. too earnest, uptight, mannered. too student.

these are again, not marks against Gang of Four - canonical post-punk without doubt - only against Gang Four as cool rock music

cool rock music does not literalize things. rather it operates in a space of ambiguity, potentiality, allowing for the mythical.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

a sense of humor is generally counterproductive for cool rock music

if it's knowing and cryptic it might be OK but only if it's not too fey - we still have to be able to rock the fuck out

silliness and even worse, wackiness, are immediate disqualifiers

think of Faust, undeniably great but too pervasively silly to be cool rock music

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

In the Flat Field is a pretty good record but it mostly just shuffles along, hardly ever rocks out even in the VU drone-rock sense

Bauhaus is good for injecting dub weight into the goth, the literally fey otherworldliness of Peter Murphy, etc but it ain't cool rock music

"St Vitus Dance" is the possible exception, in the same goth Stooges sense as early Sisters of Mercy

 

[Corpsey.]

a sense of humor is generally counterproductive for cool rock music

I think a sense of humor is near a requirement. Most of the bands weve listed here have a sense of humor. But I get what youre saying, it needs to be a certain type of humor.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

a good or great rhythm section can vastly elevate rock music, and cool rock music is littered with them

but at the same time it always ultimately comes down to the guitars, which at worst must be coequal with everything else

when you think of Bauhaus guitars are probably the least prominent element

 

[Leo]

I imagine Cool Rock Music is unrelated to rockism. Different criteria.

 

[Corpsey.]

In the Flat Field is a pretty good record but it mostly just shuffles along, hardly ever rocks out even in the VU drone-rock sense

Bauhaus is good for injecting dub weight into the goth, the literally fey otherworldliness of Peter Murphy, etc but it ain't cool rock music

"St Vitus Dance" is the possible exception, in the same goth Stooges sense as early Sisters of Mercy

Nonsense!




Not even sure of the argument here. In The Flat Field has more traditional energy than anything Wire have ever done and we agree on them.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

Abwärts doesn't have anything I would call hardcore, not even hardcore-adjacent like in a Husker Du sense

Germany for whatever reasons didn't produce a great 80s hardcore scene the way most European countries did

there were some bands, most prominently Upright Citizens, but when you compare it to Italy, Finland, Sweden, etc, slim pickings

same is basically true for France, although the French - along with Italy - by far the leaders in oi produced outside the UK

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

80s hardcore in general is a weird one in cool rock music terms

too earnest (D.C.) or too teenage idiot energy (L.A.) or both (Boston)

at the same time it was a hugely vibrant cultural force that influenced and even propagated a ton of cool rock music

there are exceptions but you'd have to take them on a case by case basis

Black Flag has I believe a solid case both for the first four years (Ginn shredding noise guitar solos) and - in a Flipper sense - the mid-era of My War etc

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

In The Flat Field has more traditional energy than anything Wire have ever done

go listen to Pink Flag if you haven't in a while and you'll understand why that's wrong

but it's not just an energy argument

you could hardly call Spacemen 3 or Les Rallizes energetic in that sense and they're both easily in the cool rock music all-time top 10

Bauhaus aren't primarily a guitars band. and they're too precious. even when they're playing faster they just meander along.

I encourage fighting your position sharply but this isn't a hill you want to die on

 

[Corpsey.]

go listen to Pink Flag if you haven't in a while and you'll understand why that's wrong

but it's not just an energy argument

you could hardly call Spacemen 3 or Les Rallizes energetic in that sense and they're both easily in the cool rock music all-time top 10

Bauhaus aren't primarily a guitars band. and they're too precious. even when they're playing faster they just meander along.

I encourage fighting your position sharply but this isn't a hill you want to die on

Insanity! They should lock you up. ITFF is teeming with energy, verging on freak out a times. Pink Flag doesnt get there, and is a little cute too, by design- both these bands are precious.




In The Flat Field is as guitar driven as VU and the Stooges. I wouldnt call Chairs Missing more guitar centric either.

Great guitar work on ITFF, really demonstrates a full scope - they screech, they drone, its heavy, dancey. The riffs can be mindlessly physical like the chromatic descent on Dark Entries or as sensitive and mapped as A God in an Alcove.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

well, I see it is the hill you want to die on

which is fine. if dissensus is nothing else, it is a place for quixotic and singular visions of music and self-created canons.

your videos aren't helping your case. that last one is basically Gang of Four, which as we already established is not cool rock music.

Wire gets precious - tho not on Pink Flag - but they're never fey. no cool rock music is.

"Dark Entries" is listless Joy Division. and so on.

Bauhaus are not cool rock music, never were cool rock music, never will be cool rock music in this universe or any other

I'm sorry but it's just how it is

 

[Corpsey.]

@padraig (u.s.)
Do you (did you) catch shows in Chicago? Do you have the scoop on good spots?

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

Do you (did you) catch shows in Chicago? Do you have the scoop on good spots?

what kinds of shows?

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

I know some spots but you'd have to be more specific

also I don't think much is open rn for obvious reasons

 

[Corpsey.]

what kinds of shows?

the type were discussing

 

[Corpsey.]

Wire gets precious - tho not on Pink Flag - but they're never fey. no cool rock music is.

cute


fey

Siouxsie + the Banshees are definitely cool rock music through the early singles and first LP

Im calling the police. You cant keep getting away with this

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

btw this is the live video that gets the case across for MC5 as a legitimately good rock band, if not cool rock music

Kramer pulling Raw Power guitar moves, hammering rhythm section, Fred Sonic Smith looking like a young god, etc


and this is them as turned-on ex-greasers doing their own ca. 1967 noise freakout i.e. Interstellar Overdrive or what have you