The tyranny of 130
- Thread starter droid
- Start date
OK, so we agree!
well i don't think i disagreed with you in the first place i just don't think a dj playing dnb into gamelan into vivian jackson is going to bring back vibe in london clubbing. that's all my disagreement was. the 130 stasis is a pernicious symptom, not the root cause. 130 90s housengarage (4x4) still bumps and is vibesy.
Corpsey
bandz ahoy
Third - apologies for what I wrote earlier, although I was deliberately trolling (not you specifically, techno people in general) I didn't mean to be inflammatory.
In truth I've always felt a sort of tribal emnity towards techno/house cos I got into drum n bass when other people I knew got into techno and house and I always felt like they looked down on drum n bass as if their chosen genres were more cleverer. Also because I was constantly listneing to 170bpm + music I thought house and techno were slow and boring. Dubstep was probably my gateway to slower dance music... (Although I'd succumbed to jungle by then too).
My techno taste tends towards either soulful/funky detroit stuff (theo, omar s, et al.) or super hard distorted stuff (i was really into the clairvoyants on Rinse for a while, although no doubt this isn't as hard as techno gets). Actually one of my best clubbing experiences ever (which did involve drugs I'm afraid) was seeing Marcel Dettman in a small club in Bristol.
In any case, the pompous attitude I detect in techno supremacists is more of a european, continental thing. People dressed head to toe in black. You know who I mean.
In truth I've always felt a sort of tribal emnity towards techno/house cos I got into drum n bass when other people I knew got into techno and house and I always felt like they looked down on drum n bass as if their chosen genres were more cleverer. Also because I was constantly listneing to 170bpm + music I thought house and techno were slow and boring. Dubstep was probably my gateway to slower dance music... (Although I'd succumbed to jungle by then too).
My techno taste tends towards either soulful/funky detroit stuff (theo, omar s, et al.) or super hard distorted stuff (i was really into the clairvoyants on Rinse for a while, although no doubt this isn't as hard as techno gets). Actually one of my best clubbing experiences ever (which did involve drugs I'm afraid) was seeing Marcel Dettman in a small club in Bristol.
In any case, the pompous attitude I detect in techno supremacists is more of a european, continental thing. People dressed head to toe in black. You know who I mean.
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
The techno black bloc listening to their Drumcodes and Adam Beyers and feeling like the chosen ones cos they got into berghain are maybe one of the most annoying factions in dance music nowadays. How did that stuff get to be so popular? I feel my energy draining so fast when that shit starts droning on.
this is the thing though the mr. c types logically lead to that because they'd already reduced techno
to a chin strokers thing. rob hood is minimal but funky as fuck. beyer never has been.
no disagreements from me on any of that.
I'm not even into a lot of the techno that gets played at most clubs today.
chava
Well-known member
Beyer was always a poor mans Surgeon. Some revere his early work, but back then the real chin strokers (I was one of them) did regard Beyer as lacking finesse. Functionalism in a bad way.
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
He'd be first against the wall for crimes against the club.
there's one where he straight tries to rip off landstrumm and it's ... decent. i have a theory it was actually produced by landstrumm - although of course it never says this on discogs credits...
definitely produced by landstrumm for some cash.
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
I read thru the thread + it did eventually get into some interesting areas
gotta say tho, OP really just makes me wanna listen to 4 on the floor with blazing guitar solos over the top of it
sorry droid
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
Idk about that tho
obv the pace of change has massively accelerated
but it's not as if prior historical moments were frozen in time
and timeless isn't just timeless, it's subjective, both personally + culturally
I don't know to what extent an innate human desire for the new exists, but I'm sure it somehow does exist
what you're discussing basically sounds like folk culture, non (or yet to be, anyway) monetized
and that is something capitalism, especially its current iteration, has been doing away with and/or altering
when I was over there I talked to Eden + Droid (probably Luka too, don't remember) about the increasing pace and ferocity of recapturing space - physical, emotional, mental, ideological - for monetization, consumption
this is antithetical to folk culture, which must be captured, made into a product, branded, monetized
one example: that dipshit Bikram yoga guy trying to copyright yoga poses that have been around for hundreds of years or more
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
No, and that's not what I said. But there are plenty of places in the world, and in the last year or so I've been to some, where you can hear people playing the same songs as they always have been and getting the same joy from them, as they always have been and its a wonderful thing to witness. Not because I'm a westerner who wants to hold onto the past but because joy is infectious.
Regarding what I just said above, I'd have to say that there are certain things which are timeless. The peopke who enjoy them don't feel the need to change them. The same with certain tempos, rhythms, timbres. They're very well used and they hit a certain spot in us. thirdform can attest to this as he has done before. Its not always about westerners imposing shit from the outside. Some people in some parts of the world like old shit and keep playing it for their own enjoyment without any concern for what's going on outside of it. Those same countries have plenty of music which evolves too. Modernising, even taking those old songs and playing them differently.
You've misread me at some point because I was in fact suggesting that it's not innate at all. I was saying this is something capitalism has imposed on us. In the west old is an insult. We don't respect it for the most part. It's to be discarded and replaced.
The first example that comes to mind is the fishermen of the small town Asilah in Morocco who get together every Friday night to play dominos, smoke hash, play music and sing songs the same way they always have in a little shack on the edge of the Medina near the port. They don't ask for money but you're welcome to sit, drink some mint tea, smoke hash and enjoy their company. The cast of characters naturally changes with time but the essential things stay the same and I was told it is a tradition 100s of years old.
I'm not sure if we've crossed wires here or I wasn't clear but see above.
Again see above
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I think humans always need the new but too much problem with dance music is what the market tells us is new. that doesn't mean that what the market advertises as new isn't valuable on its own merits. and of course the kids in morocco are in tune to all the pop and electronic music trends, ditto algeria. otherwise chabi would not exist!
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
Yeah, conversely there is part of us that gets bored with the old. And if you were born in the west or grew up in the 80s the likelihood is that your attention span is much shorter. But nevertheless there are still people of the same age in other parts of the world who love old musics the same way the generations before them did. This is definitely not a simple subject. But imo capitalism exploited this urge in us and made it feel like the norm. To the point where old = bad in many people's minds.
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
Agreed, even though that skirts dangerously close to many regrettable points in human history. The idea of reset inspired many a tyrant.