More MIA
- Thread starter Woebot
- Start date
blissblogger said:
"All the evidence" - I'd love to see this evidence...
A/ The idea that Le Tigre's music has been well-received through a "quasi-feminist sympathy vote" = patronising bullshit of the highest order. Leaving aside the incoherence of your point - are the "allowances" being made because there are women involved, or because of a belief in the "DIY spirit"? - you might be shocked to discover that there are people out there who don't actually agree that (any or the majority or some of) Le Tigre's music is "defective dance music". Of course I realise that if this kind of benefit of the doubt was extended to the fans of the artists who don't get your seal of approval, huge chunks of your argument against M.I.A.'s music would crumble away...
B/ I'm not aware of anyone who's claimed that that M.I.A. should be "beyond criticism by dint of (her) skin". If you didn't want the issue of the colour of her skin to come up, Simon, maybe you shouldn't have brought it up yourself in such a crass way, with the implication that it was some kind of clever artificial marketing ruse designed to fool credulous liberal hipsters...
Anyway, now that we've established that making a record is an UNACCEPTABLE way for a person who doesn't have the right credentials to express their love of a kind of music that requires these credentials (not that I accept that any of these credentials exist, you understand, but I'm playing along because I find this all so fascinating), and that instead they should just start a blog (ACCEPTABLE) so they can say bucky and gwan and ting and never have their background discussed in such depth, can I ask which side of the fence DJing falls? Are you allowed to make mixes and put them online as long as you never play in a club? Are you allowed to release compilations as long as you don't actually make any tracks yourself?
blissblogger
Well-known member
tamil le tigres and high horses
why would i be shocked? i know they have a following. the missus loves them. i actually like a few of their tunes. however the general impression i've got is that le tigre approach dance music in the same spirit that k. hanna has approached all her music making -- that attitude counts for more than expertise. unfortunately in dance music that doesn't work. not that you need to have expertise in any traditional musical sense, but dance genres are unforgiving. your track either works or it is doesn't. there is no such thing as amateurish charm in dance music.
this is actually where DIY in dance music and DIY in rock are quite different. DIY in dance music is purely about the autonomous cultural production side, people doing it in the bedrooms etc. but each of them are striving to make as professional-sounding and dancefloor functioning tune as they can. there is no cult of amateurishness that you often get with rock diy, no concessions from an ideologically-sympathising audience.
none of this applies to the MIA record which is well made and would cut it on various dancefloors.
in terms of skin and your other high horsey mouth points, well... let's take this scenario. say instead of Peaches giving the roland groovebox to MIA etc etc, it was actually Peaches who got really taken with dancehall/reggaeton/rio funk/etc etc, and who decided to do a project called, i dunno, Beeyatches maybe... now her first record was well-done, tough techno beats, i liked it a lot, she's very good live, so there's no reason to think she couldn't pull off a meta-shanty record a la Arular. but people might look askance at her doing the faux-patois.
in MIA's case i really think some people look at her and assume from the colour of skin that she somehow has more proximity to these musics -- from jamaica, brazil, puerto rico, etc -- than a white artist who operated from a similar starting point that she does. so there's less dissonance.
i'm not going to bother with the rest of your questions, i've made the point already -- sure, anyone can do whatever they want with any music they want... equally we're all free to express our opinions as to whether the result is convincing or satisfying in itself, or measures up to the original musics that inspired or influenced it, or does anything interestingly different with them, takes them anywhere ... i've explored my ambivalences, weighed up the pros and the cons as i see them... in some detail! but i would have been totally happy to leave it at the original 800 word article if not for the flak storm.
finally, i must say it's been hilarious to see the kneejerk "authenticty! how dare you!" brigade get all frothed up with indignation when the Arular project is nothing if not based around ideas of realness and street. in the new issue of Urb there's a Diplo cover story in which he goes on about his trips to Rio favelas and bailes funk in terms of that scene having a "realness" that's way beyond anything in american electronic music or hip hop; he repeatedly, and with some pride, talks about going into areas where "no Gringo" goes, lots of details about guys with guns at the dances, 12 year olds dealing drugs, etc. Although it's not a MIA piece, she is quoted in there describing her project as a kind of world "homeless music" -- which I take to mean a kind of 4th World take on the various forms of shanty house. This is why the "it's really got more to do with electroclash" angle is unconvincing to me, after all electroclash was in part about fakeness, gender as performativity, the celebration of inauthenticity, artitifce etc.
B/ I'm not aware of anyone who's claimed that that M.I.A. should be "beyond criticism by dint of (her) skin". If you didn't want the issue of the colour of her skin to come up, Simon, maybe you shouldn't have brought it up yourself in such a crass way, with the implication that it was some kind of clever artificial marketing ruse designed to fool credulous liberal hipsters...
Anyway, now that we've established that making a record is an UNACCEPTABLE way for a person who doesn't have the right credentials to express their love of a kind of music that requires these credentials (not that I accept that any of these credentials exist, you understand, but I'm playing along because I find this all so fascinating), and that instead they should just start a blog (ACCEPTABLE) so they can say bucky and gwan and ting and never have their background discussed in such depth, can I ask which side of the fence DJing falls? Are you allowed to make mixes and put them online as long as you never play in a club? Are you allowed to release compilations as long as you don't actually make any tracks yourself? [/QUOTE]
Flyboy said:
why would i be shocked? i know they have a following. the missus loves them. i actually like a few of their tunes. however the general impression i've got is that le tigre approach dance music in the same spirit that k. hanna has approached all her music making -- that attitude counts for more than expertise. unfortunately in dance music that doesn't work. not that you need to have expertise in any traditional musical sense, but dance genres are unforgiving. your track either works or it is doesn't. there is no such thing as amateurish charm in dance music.
this is actually where DIY in dance music and DIY in rock are quite different. DIY in dance music is purely about the autonomous cultural production side, people doing it in the bedrooms etc. but each of them are striving to make as professional-sounding and dancefloor functioning tune as they can. there is no cult of amateurishness that you often get with rock diy, no concessions from an ideologically-sympathising audience.
none of this applies to the MIA record which is well made and would cut it on various dancefloors.
in terms of skin and your other high horsey mouth points, well... let's take this scenario. say instead of Peaches giving the roland groovebox to MIA etc etc, it was actually Peaches who got really taken with dancehall/reggaeton/rio funk/etc etc, and who decided to do a project called, i dunno, Beeyatches maybe... now her first record was well-done, tough techno beats, i liked it a lot, she's very good live, so there's no reason to think she couldn't pull off a meta-shanty record a la Arular. but people might look askance at her doing the faux-patois.
in MIA's case i really think some people look at her and assume from the colour of skin that she somehow has more proximity to these musics -- from jamaica, brazil, puerto rico, etc -- than a white artist who operated from a similar starting point that she does. so there's less dissonance.
i'm not going to bother with the rest of your questions, i've made the point already -- sure, anyone can do whatever they want with any music they want... equally we're all free to express our opinions as to whether the result is convincing or satisfying in itself, or measures up to the original musics that inspired or influenced it, or does anything interestingly different with them, takes them anywhere ... i've explored my ambivalences, weighed up the pros and the cons as i see them... in some detail! but i would have been totally happy to leave it at the original 800 word article if not for the flak storm.
finally, i must say it's been hilarious to see the kneejerk "authenticty! how dare you!" brigade get all frothed up with indignation when the Arular project is nothing if not based around ideas of realness and street. in the new issue of Urb there's a Diplo cover story in which he goes on about his trips to Rio favelas and bailes funk in terms of that scene having a "realness" that's way beyond anything in american electronic music or hip hop; he repeatedly, and with some pride, talks about going into areas where "no Gringo" goes, lots of details about guys with guns at the dances, 12 year olds dealing drugs, etc. Although it's not a MIA piece, she is quoted in there describing her project as a kind of world "homeless music" -- which I take to mean a kind of 4th World take on the various forms of shanty house. This is why the "it's really got more to do with electroclash" angle is unconvincing to me, after all electroclash was in part about fakeness, gender as performativity, the celebration of inauthenticity, artitifce etc.
B/ I'm not aware of anyone who's claimed that that M.I.A. should be "beyond criticism by dint of (her) skin". If you didn't want the issue of the colour of her skin to come up, Simon, maybe you shouldn't have brought it up yourself in such a crass way, with the implication that it was some kind of clever artificial marketing ruse designed to fool credulous liberal hipsters...
Anyway, now that we've established that making a record is an UNACCEPTABLE way for a person who doesn't have the right credentials to express their love of a kind of music that requires these credentials (not that I accept that any of these credentials exist, you understand, but I'm playing along because I find this all so fascinating), and that instead they should just start a blog (ACCEPTABLE) so they can say bucky and gwan and ting and never have their background discussed in such depth, can I ask which side of the fence DJing falls? Are you allowed to make mixes and put them online as long as you never play in a club? Are you allowed to release compilations as long as you don't actually make any tracks yourself? [/QUOTE]
Ness Rowlah
Norwegian Wood
she's got the boingboing "seal of approval" now as well: oh dear.
http://www.boingboing.net/2005/03/12/mia_for_intergalacti.html
I've read all this stuff now and listened to some MP3s.
For me it just sound pretty OKish - nothing more, nothing less,
but nothing to get excited about? I mean they make her sound
like she's married Einstein with the Beatles-Kraftwerk-grime-"world".
---
Very similar to hype surrounding "the grey album". after reading it was the hottest
thing released for yonks (that is a technical term) and how it made
people "rethink the way they thought about music" I was excited when I finally
downloaded it. I was quite disappointed ... eh --- "is this it?", sort of "sensation".
I don't like Blur - but that quote from Alex James is good
And sometimes it's just OK, like MIA
And whoever mentioned the Slits in this thread, good call.
http://www.boingboing.net/2005/03/12/mia_for_intergalacti.html
I've read all this stuff now and listened to some MP3s.
For me it just sound pretty OKish - nothing more, nothing less,
but nothing to get excited about? I mean they make her sound
like she's married Einstein with the Beatles-Kraftwerk-grime-"world".
---
Very similar to hype surrounding "the grey album". after reading it was the hottest
thing released for yonks (that is a technical term) and how it made
people "rethink the way they thought about music" I was excited when I finally
downloaded it. I was quite disappointed ... eh --- "is this it?", sort of "sensation".
I don't like Blur - but that quote from Alex James is good
But music is simple: you listen to it and decide whether you like it or you don’t.
And sometimes it's just OK, like MIA
And whoever mentioned the Slits in this thread, good call.
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2stepfan said:
Nicely summed up, mate.
MIA, at least in my abstract theoretical conception, MIA is the necessary pop-hybrid crossover act. Its very rare for a 'pure' underground trailblazer to be the crossover act. Like, it wasn't Mudhoney that broke grunge, it was Nirvana. It wasn't Acen that broke rave to the pop audience, it was the Prodigy. She's just a bit further along the spectrum. Really, this is a massive overreaction I think.
She's just releasing music she likes/thinks is trendy - I see no difference between what she does and what Bjork does.
So she makes music that draws heavily from various underappreciated streets and reshapes it into something more easily digested. The problem is...?
believekevin
Well-known member
Oi, get me, DJ'ing is okay as long as you wear Ecko but not Rocawear, innit blud?
Jesse D Serrins
Well-known member
puretokyo said:
Grievous Angel
Beast of Burden
Top cat BlissMan:
But there is a difference between the thing itself crossing over and some not-quite-right external take on it crossing over.... the MIA record will get the critical attention and acclaim that a brilliant album like that Ward 21 one will never get.
OK, I get this, and I will tread carefully because it's the sort of thing I can get quite irritated by. But what I am focusing on is that difference that you have highlighted. To me, the poppiness of it means that I just don't compare it with "real" dancehall or whatever. I compare it with Gwen Stefani or Girls Aloud or Kylie and while it's a bit bouncier and grittier than them, it's doing the same sort of thing. And I'm not sure that MIA really is capturing the PR resources that rightfully belong to Ward 21: analytically, without making a value judgement about either artist, they're different products aimed at different markets, and MIA's addressable market is a lot bigger than Ward 21's. It's a shame and it's a product of racism and capitalism but it's not MIA's "fault" -- there doesn't seem to me to be much mileage in "blaming" her for the lack of cross-over success in dancehall or other musics. It seems to me that she presents herself as exactly what she is -- a dance act operating at the poppy end of the genre who wants a crossover hit or three, who uses quite nice mid-tempo sequenced breaks that sound like slowed-down Basement Jaxx doing ragga-ish stuff. She doesn't present herself as -- or sound like -- a dancehall act, or a Rio Funk act, or whatever.
Anyway, this analysis may either sharpen or subdue the antipathy the anti-MIA camp have toward her!
Now, a side issue...
DIY in dance music is purely about the autonomous cultural production side, people doing it in the bedrooms etc. but each of them are striving to make as professional-sounding and dancefloor functioning tune as they can. there is no cult of amateurishness that you often get with rock diy
Yeah I see what you mean, but... maybe I'm being stoopid (Dissensus: "what do mean, maybe?") but the corrolary of this argument seems to be that all dance records will tend to sound very professional, very produced, very much like BIG TUNES, a la Shapeshifters (whom I love!) or possibly Masters at Work (whom I also love). And that's not the case.
For, I think there is a "cult of amateurishness" surrounding artists like Congo Natty (always the same brittle but brilliant Atari drum sequences, bass samples with the tail cut off, really terrible EQ and mastering a lot of the time -- none of which detracts from the vitality or longevity of the records) or Andy Weatherall or for that matter loads of acid house records (wonky out of time sequences, noisy masters etc.).
I don't think that professionalism is a consuming aim of dance music producers, rather I think it's mainly because they can. It's now dead easy to make a professional-sounding record. You can use a pirated copy of Waves (specialist plug-in software that does pro-level compression and EQ) and turn a tune that was made with Fruityloops on an ancient Dell into something that sounds amazing. Especially if you can do it on a decent set of monitors. And rhythmic precision and quality of musical performance are easy to achieve in dance music anyway because you can simply sample those characteristics.
But the same things distinguish amater productions in dance music as in cult of amateurishness rock music: a strong, well realised musical idea. Yes, the dancefloor represents a viciously unforgiving "market" in which to compete, but I'm not sure that "professionalism" is what distinguishes successful competitors. I mean, it's easy for a competent producer to get everything in time, in tune and sounding amazing; it's everything else that makes it work, and I suspect "attitude" is important.
Maybe Simon means something different.
But there is a difference between the thing itself crossing over and some not-quite-right external take on it crossing over.... the MIA record will get the critical attention and acclaim that a brilliant album like that Ward 21 one will never get.
OK, I get this, and I will tread carefully because it's the sort of thing I can get quite irritated by. But what I am focusing on is that difference that you have highlighted. To me, the poppiness of it means that I just don't compare it with "real" dancehall or whatever. I compare it with Gwen Stefani or Girls Aloud or Kylie and while it's a bit bouncier and grittier than them, it's doing the same sort of thing. And I'm not sure that MIA really is capturing the PR resources that rightfully belong to Ward 21: analytically, without making a value judgement about either artist, they're different products aimed at different markets, and MIA's addressable market is a lot bigger than Ward 21's. It's a shame and it's a product of racism and capitalism but it's not MIA's "fault" -- there doesn't seem to me to be much mileage in "blaming" her for the lack of cross-over success in dancehall or other musics. It seems to me that she presents herself as exactly what she is -- a dance act operating at the poppy end of the genre who wants a crossover hit or three, who uses quite nice mid-tempo sequenced breaks that sound like slowed-down Basement Jaxx doing ragga-ish stuff. She doesn't present herself as -- or sound like -- a dancehall act, or a Rio Funk act, or whatever.
Anyway, this analysis may either sharpen or subdue the antipathy the anti-MIA camp have toward her!
Now, a side issue...
DIY in dance music is purely about the autonomous cultural production side, people doing it in the bedrooms etc. but each of them are striving to make as professional-sounding and dancefloor functioning tune as they can. there is no cult of amateurishness that you often get with rock diy
Yeah I see what you mean, but... maybe I'm being stoopid (Dissensus: "what do mean, maybe?") but the corrolary of this argument seems to be that all dance records will tend to sound very professional, very produced, very much like BIG TUNES, a la Shapeshifters (whom I love!) or possibly Masters at Work (whom I also love). And that's not the case.
For, I think there is a "cult of amateurishness" surrounding artists like Congo Natty (always the same brittle but brilliant Atari drum sequences, bass samples with the tail cut off, really terrible EQ and mastering a lot of the time -- none of which detracts from the vitality or longevity of the records) or Andy Weatherall or for that matter loads of acid house records (wonky out of time sequences, noisy masters etc.).
I don't think that professionalism is a consuming aim of dance music producers, rather I think it's mainly because they can. It's now dead easy to make a professional-sounding record. You can use a pirated copy of Waves (specialist plug-in software that does pro-level compression and EQ) and turn a tune that was made with Fruityloops on an ancient Dell into something that sounds amazing. Especially if you can do it on a decent set of monitors. And rhythmic precision and quality of musical performance are easy to achieve in dance music anyway because you can simply sample those characteristics.
But the same things distinguish amater productions in dance music as in cult of amateurishness rock music: a strong, well realised musical idea. Yes, the dancefloor represents a viciously unforgiving "market" in which to compete, but I'm not sure that "professionalism" is what distinguishes successful competitors. I mean, it's easy for a competent producer to get everything in time, in tune and sounding amazing; it's everything else that makes it work, and I suspect "attitude" is important.
Maybe Simon means something different.
Logan Sama
BestThereIsAtWhatIDo
I don't mind MIA. She is so far removed from the grime scene as a whole she can't be classified as an artist who is exploiting it for media coverage or credibilty.
And when I heard some of her stuff from XL it draws on a large number of different musical influences. The record just sounds like it was made by someone who listens to a wide variety of currently popular underground music. Whether that someone is MIA herself or whoever executively produced the album is by the by.
I don't even really mind Sovereign, she doesn't make any unfounded claims about being part of the Grime scene and probably makes fun of herself on records more than some of her detractors do. But she's postiioned a lot closer to the Grime scene without using enough other elements to distinguish herself as an artist making music inspired by influences from a broader spectrum of genres. She's not grime, but isn't really anything else. Which is perplexing.
MIA, to get back on track, I just see as music which doesn't really have anything to do with the scene I'm part of. It's just cool she thinks Grime is good enough to be included in her radius of musical magpieing.
And when I heard some of her stuff from XL it draws on a large number of different musical influences. The record just sounds like it was made by someone who listens to a wide variety of currently popular underground music. Whether that someone is MIA herself or whoever executively produced the album is by the by.
I don't even really mind Sovereign, she doesn't make any unfounded claims about being part of the Grime scene and probably makes fun of herself on records more than some of her detractors do. But she's postiioned a lot closer to the Grime scene without using enough other elements to distinguish herself as an artist making music inspired by influences from a broader spectrum of genres. She's not grime, but isn't really anything else. Which is perplexing.
MIA, to get back on track, I just see as music which doesn't really have anything to do with the scene I'm part of. It's just cool she thinks Grime is good enough to be included in her radius of musical magpieing.
Ness Rowlah
Norwegian Wood
so what about this piece of art found on her website (attached hopefully, if not it can be found
on her webpages http://www.miauk.com/).
I guess in my twisted mind I see it as some sort of "celebration of Sep 11";
not good whatever your religous or political views are.
on her webpages http://www.miauk.com/).
I guess in my twisted mind I see it as some sort of "celebration of Sep 11";
not good whatever your religous or political views are.
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blissblogger
Well-known member
call the professionals
>For, I think there is a "cult of amateurishness" surrounding artists like Congo Natty (always the same >brittle but brilliant Atari drum sequences, bass samples with the tail cut off, really terrible EQ and >mastering a lot of the time -- none of which detracts from the vitality or longevity of the records) or Andy >Weatherall or for that matter loads of acid house records (wonky out of time sequences, noisy masters >etc.).
i should probably have used a different word than 'professional' as it has connotations of soul-less artisanry and slickness
what i meant really was standard vs substandard, if you make a track it must meet the standards of the scene, what the DJs can use... so for instance i hear you re. the relative lo-fi of a lot of jungle records, but within the terms of the scene, the Congo Natty records were consummate, surely. with dance music the beat has to work, there's no such thing as dancing in sympathy.
similarly grime's sound quality is shitty, but within that norm there is a span from excellent grime to lame grime, and the lame grime gets discarded
whereas with the riot grrrl scene out of which Le Tigre came out of it, a lot of it was about listening-with-sympathy -- joe carducci calls this syndrome an aural equivalent to persistence of vision when you watch 24 frames of cinema per second and seeing a moving image-- ie. people listen to a band, hear what its sonic intent is, and compensate for the deficiences and shortfalls by a kind of self-willed act of aural hallucination, because with this kind of punkoid DIY, it's the spectacle of kids/grrrls doing it for themselves that is the buzz, you identify with the impulse to autonomy, the struggle to master the instruments .... you got that with shambling bands, with the beat happening/K scene, earlier with the post-swell mapsy type postpunk diy bands... it's fine yknow, there's arguments for it that i buy up to a point -- but it just doesn't translate to dance music on account of the funktionality of dance culture
and even le tigre's best records, like 'deceptacon' wouldn't get much currency on a dancefloor, except maybe an electroclashy one where there's that cult of attitude going on plus a deliberate retro-ness that means beats don't need to be state-of-the-art anyway
it's symptomatic of this thing where le tigre, they know there's some action going on dance culture, they'd sort of like to partake of it but not really -- cos it would be too much work. so they offer the external take, which plays well to a certain audience.
all a bit of digression from MIA, whose music is not defective but has other deficiences, for this listener, and about which i've said enough
that graphic of the towers though, is a/ horrible to look at, like a birthday card and b/ i'd say favors the case for the prosecution, i think someone should forward it to son-of-a-firefighter (as opposed to child of a freedom fighter) Christgau
i also enjoyed the information that she wears a pendant of a Kashkolnikov around her neck
>For, I think there is a "cult of amateurishness" surrounding artists like Congo Natty (always the same >brittle but brilliant Atari drum sequences, bass samples with the tail cut off, really terrible EQ and >mastering a lot of the time -- none of which detracts from the vitality or longevity of the records) or Andy >Weatherall or for that matter loads of acid house records (wonky out of time sequences, noisy masters >etc.).
i should probably have used a different word than 'professional' as it has connotations of soul-less artisanry and slickness
what i meant really was standard vs substandard, if you make a track it must meet the standards of the scene, what the DJs can use... so for instance i hear you re. the relative lo-fi of a lot of jungle records, but within the terms of the scene, the Congo Natty records were consummate, surely. with dance music the beat has to work, there's no such thing as dancing in sympathy.
similarly grime's sound quality is shitty, but within that norm there is a span from excellent grime to lame grime, and the lame grime gets discarded
whereas with the riot grrrl scene out of which Le Tigre came out of it, a lot of it was about listening-with-sympathy -- joe carducci calls this syndrome an aural equivalent to persistence of vision when you watch 24 frames of cinema per second and seeing a moving image-- ie. people listen to a band, hear what its sonic intent is, and compensate for the deficiences and shortfalls by a kind of self-willed act of aural hallucination, because with this kind of punkoid DIY, it's the spectacle of kids/grrrls doing it for themselves that is the buzz, you identify with the impulse to autonomy, the struggle to master the instruments .... you got that with shambling bands, with the beat happening/K scene, earlier with the post-swell mapsy type postpunk diy bands... it's fine yknow, there's arguments for it that i buy up to a point -- but it just doesn't translate to dance music on account of the funktionality of dance culture
and even le tigre's best records, like 'deceptacon' wouldn't get much currency on a dancefloor, except maybe an electroclashy one where there's that cult of attitude going on plus a deliberate retro-ness that means beats don't need to be state-of-the-art anyway
it's symptomatic of this thing where le tigre, they know there's some action going on dance culture, they'd sort of like to partake of it but not really -- cos it would be too much work. so they offer the external take, which plays well to a certain audience.
all a bit of digression from MIA, whose music is not defective but has other deficiences, for this listener, and about which i've said enough
that graphic of the towers though, is a/ horrible to look at, like a birthday card and b/ i'd say favors the case for the prosecution, i think someone should forward it to son-of-a-firefighter (as opposed to child of a freedom fighter) Christgau
i also enjoyed the information that she wears a pendant of a Kashkolnikov around her neck
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Diggedy Derek
Stray Dog
I was sceptical about both Le Tigre and Chicks On Speed, but thought each was actually fantastically danceable live. Not as good as proper dance music, but still. MIA actually sounds terrific in a club as you say.
Persistence of vision is an almost physical thing, isn't it, it's not your brain filling in the gaps as much as the image actually still being there on your retina. It's totally involuntary, it's not even subconscious. Nice metaphor though.
I've got quite a few thoughts on MIA, but, while idly checking out the 5 second soundclips on her site, the most glaring fault is that (as Luka says) the vocals sound utterly ridiculous. I can't see anyone taking that
twang to heart for more than one album really.
Persistence of vision is an almost physical thing, isn't it, it's not your brain filling in the gaps as much as the image actually still being there on your retina. It's totally involuntary, it's not even subconscious. Nice metaphor though.
I've got quite a few thoughts on MIA, but, while idly checking out the 5 second soundclips on her site, the most glaring fault is that (as Luka says) the vocals sound utterly ridiculous. I can't see anyone taking that
twang to heart for more than one album really.
Any opinions of the interview with her posted on Pitchfork today?
She didn't sound so unreasonable---not nearly as bad as I expected given the description of her stage talk re $20 bill on Mr Reynolds blog ...
Anyway I'm going to go see her play this week and see how things pan out.
She didn't sound so unreasonable---not nearly as bad as I expected given the description of her stage talk re $20 bill on Mr Reynolds blog ...
Anyway I'm going to go see her play this week and see how things pan out.
Grievous Angel
Beast of Burden
Nice one, I think all sides have done their thing and all have acquitted themselves well. I understand, too, Si's points on the "professionalism" issue: "MIA's music is not defective but has other deficiences, for this listener" -- well, alright.
For the record, I'm with Logan Sama.
Now, next thread...
For the record, I'm with Logan Sama.
Now, next thread...
Matos_W.K.
Active member
WOEBOT said:
I like that--I "ran the script." No, I heard a record, had no back knowledge about it, and came to a conclusion based entirely on what I was hearing. If that's lazy or non-committal, oh fucking well.
Matos_W.K.
Active member
I must say, though, that considering how many litmus tests seem to be applied to this album on here, partly but not limited to the "if you aren't completely involved with a scene from the word go and aren't paying PROPAH homage to the folks who PROPAH-ly make it in its PROPAH setting, your opinion doesn't count and you're just a fucking poseur" school of critical thought (yes I'm deliberately overstating, you're welcome), it seems like my hearing-and-liking-then-asking-questions approach means I'm running far fewer scripts on it than plenty of other people on here. (I shouldn't even say "on here," should I, given how seldom I check the boards?)
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