Fascism!
- Thread starter josef k.
- Start date
you said several times that youd gun me down, i think..
you wouldnt kill anyone? ever? not even a nazi? ustase (croatian fascists) killed half of my fathers family.. using violence here is not just?
also.. were you the one who wanted the crossed out humanism tattoo?
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Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
BOMBDOG.
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Edit: oh fuck this, just click the link
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nomadthethird
more issues than Time mag
Brighton Beach? N train? East New York? Canarsie?
What makes you think I live in NY? Why this obsession with where I live? What do you care?
nomadthethird
more issues than Time mag
No, I would not kill a Nazi. I would never contribute to any violent efforts of any sort. The only time I would ever even consider resorting to violence would be if I was being directly threatened with violence at someone else's hands. And then I would only try to maim, and get free, not kill the other person.
There is nothing humanistic about taking a moral stance against violence. I believe the right to be free from violent harm is a basic right that we should extend to people (like health care, among many others)--not because I believe humans are essentially good, but because I believe humans can be very very violent, and this impulse is not conducive to healthy social interaction. Ever. I believe the negative tendencies of humans need to be fought against, not surrendered to for the sake of some cosmic Ideal (i.e. communism).
Humanism is not identical to just any moral stance. Humanism is a doctrine of essentialism that makes claims about universal traits that make humans what they are. Communists are humanists, who believe that humans are essentially "equal" and all essentially good--that it is only capitalism or unjust power structures that cause all human problems.
I am not a humanist, because I do not believe there is an essence of humanity. I believe humans are determined by several factors--biological/genetic, social, economic, linguistic, cultural, etc. I believe humans display a whole range of behaviors that is never static, unchanging, or universal. If you change the factors that determine human behavior, to the best of your ability, by refusing to support, or abide by, or further, or participate in negative, destructive behaviors (on interpersonal, cultural, and global-social levels), you change the way humans are likely to behave. Humans are not essentially any one thing. Humans are all different and always morphing into different beings.
In order to make people what I want them to be--peaceful, non-violent, non-aggressive, not petty, not psychotic, not mass hysterical creatures--it is necessary that violence be avoided at all costs. The costs of violence on human social interactions is just too great in terms of irreparable damage to be worth it, not even with the best of intentions. In fact, I believe that the means are the ends--if you are forced to use violence to bring about a regime, that regime will be violent.
Two wrongs don't make a right.
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nomadthethird
more issues than Time mag
Nikbee, you're quite the swift one. You realize that the one post I wrote about shooting you was a joke, right? A little parody making fun of your stupid, lame empty threats? (I guess writing "chuckle" directly after the statement wasn't enough of a hint for you that I wasn't in earnest...)
Edit: I've also written on here a million times where my apartment used to be. Are you seriously trying to pretend it's some sort of feat that you were able to look up basic information about where I lived and went to school on this board, where I've openly talked about it several times?
Or should we add ESP to your resume, under skills, Crescan?
Edit: I've also written on here a million times where my apartment used to be. Are you seriously trying to pretend it's some sort of feat that you were able to look up basic information about where I lived and went to school on this board, where I've openly talked about it several times?
Or should we add ESP to your resume, under skills, Crescan?
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i understood it was a joke.. of course..
the 'camps' were a joke!
ill get back to you on your humanism.. i have to go work.
and ive no idea where youre from.. relax. just a lil predictable, thats all.
most of your posts have been so crazy, i seriously seriously thought that you were just fucking with me.. playing some kind of joke..
you would not kill a nazi? well, they would kill you, no problem.
ustase came to my grandfathers village, made them dig their own graves, and shot them in the forest.. they killed almost the entire village of 250 people.. the villagers did nothing but be Serb. they were living peacefully, until a very destructive force came along (fascists). how do you counteract this force?
is there something to negotiate here? this is a force of pure destruction. would you give them flowers? build schools? explain to them the wonders of humanity?
you seem to have many crappy associations with communism. i dont know where you get this, probably your fancy education.. it prevents you from thinking.. you cant think..
communism does NOT equal humanism ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Althusser ).. where do you get this stuff?! i can give you some reading material, but does it matter? i dont think so.. you dont know how to read..
the only universality for a communist Subject is the impossible.. thats it.. yes, "abstract", but abstraction MATTERS (to put it as stupidly as fucking possible). this is what makes me human.. the desire to "think what might be in terms that break radically with what is."
individualism itself, and its obsession with difference is the problem.. i think badiou offers something wonderful in that regard.. he 'punctures' a whole through it. you need a good puncturing.
edit: ok now i really gotta go work.
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john eden
male pale and stale
Well nomad has said that she might violenty engage with someone who was out to hurt her, which would include nazis.
However the point is surely that by the time they turn up at your village and ask you to dig your own grave, it is too late for any sort of individualised resistance.
"fascism doesn't start with concentration camps, that's where it ends"
However the point is surely that by the time they turn up at your village and ask you to dig your own grave, it is too late for any sort of individualised resistance.
"fascism doesn't start with concentration camps, that's where it ends"
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
Nikbee, tell me this: when a fascist murders someone, is it inherently worse than when a communist murders someone? Or, if you prefer, when a "communist" murders someone (if you're keen to retain the distinction between communism-as-an-ideal and communism-as-it-has-been-historically-enacted*)?
*Leaving aside the whole question of the validity of this distinction, which I tried to engage you with yesterday and got a load of mystical guff about Truth-Events and libidinal goo for my troubles.
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mistersloane
heavy heavy monster sound
Libidial
http://www.labodiscount.com/female-sexuality/Libidial.asp
You so lucky. I never get any libidial goo round here.
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
Labial goo is where it's at, daddyo.
scottdisco
rip this joint please
to briefly take up Vim's excellent takedown on Mao's famine crimes, interesting to remember the KMT were the bigger force of the two (competing, never really truly allied) Chinese blocs fighting the Japanese during WWII, but after that war the Communists quickly managed to take advantage of a lot of KMT eyes-off-prize blunders, including some incredibly serious and unpopular mistakes which helped the increasingly popular Commies no end.
who knows, maybe if the USA hadn't withdrawn support for the KMT during the Civil War, things might have turned out differently. (although the KMT ended up getting completely owned, so, hey.)
indeed.
so, armies to fight fascist armies required?
i thought Nomad's middle paragraph on humanism and several factors was masterful.
who knows, maybe if the USA hadn't withdrawn support for the KMT during the Civil War, things might have turned out differently. (although the KMT ended up getting completely owned, so, hey.)
indeed.
so, armies to fight fascist armies required?
i thought Nomad's middle paragraph on humanism and several factors was masterful.
john eden
male pale and stale
Well that isn't something I would have any influence over. My take on this is that people have a duty to prevent fascism from taking hold in their own communities.
But yeah, respect to all the people in the International Brigades who went off to fight in the Spanish Civil War.
STN
sou'wester
If you let yourself be defeated by them, just because you are too fair to hit back the same way they hit at you, there won't be any methods but Nazi methods! If you preach the Rules of the Game while they use every foul and filthy trick against you, they will laugh at you! They'll think you're weak, decadent! I thought so myself in 1919!
You mustn't mind me, an old alien, saying all this. But who can describe hydrophobia better than one who has been bitten - and is now immune.
etc
You mustn't mind me, an old alien, saying all this. But who can describe hydrophobia better than one who has been bitten - and is now immune.
etc