Fascism!

to explain further:

why Stalin was a sack of shit = why parliamentary-capitalism is a sack of shit (both are a finitude, both contain the "not included subject"): lets take the notion of human rights, for example.. human rights is inherently linked to the power of the nation state, it fails to provide rights for those that are excluded, or persecuted by the nation states. Ranciere: '‘Either the rights of the citizen are the rights of man – but the rights of man are the rights of the unpoliticized person; they are the rights of those who have no rights, which amounts to nothing – or the rights of man are the rights of the citizen, the rights attached to the fact of being a citizen. This means that they are the rights of those who have rights, which amounts to a tautology.’' Both Ranciere and Badiou aim at creating a new form of political agency. This stance on agency needs to present a theory of political agency that is able to ground agency on a firm footing that counters the power-structures at work, yet that at the same can accommodate something radically new in order to escape elevating this grounding of agency into a fundamentalism. Badiou and Rancière both formulate a theory that escapes these pitfalls by applying the conceptual tool of ‘belonging but not included’. This stance leads to a new rereading of human rights, and a re-definition of doing politics.

"A political moment is then a moment in which an included subject that does not belong acts on the current situation."

Yeah, Maoists are great at not violating human rights.

nikbee said:

This stance leads to a new rereading of human rights, and a re-definition of doing politics.

"A political moment is then a moment in which an included subject that does not belong acts on the current situation."

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No, it doesn't. It amounts to a bunch of empty rhetoric that grounds nothing.

nomadthethird said:

My "Real" is that if you have to hurt/kill other people to get your way, your way is evil.

My "Real" is that there's no such thing as freedom in a biologically determined world. We will never be free. We are not transcendental subjects.

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your "Real" is univeral, no? but the worst kind of universal, its relativist. not every violence is equal, at least i dont think so. you need to think of violence beyond just bludgeoned heads.. im violated all the time by the systematic nihilism of capitalism.. this is violence to me.. the worst kind. worse than the Stalin gulag kind.. at least Stalin was 'honest.' the lines were drawn, i knew what i couldnt do.. period.. and this stupidity led to his downfall.. didnt we learn anything from stoszek?

Good lord the more you talk the deeper you bury yourself in horseshit.

This is the funniest shit that's happened on Dissensus in a long time.

nomadthethird said:

Good lord the more you talk the deeper you bury yourself in horseshit.

This is the funniest shit that's happened on Dissensus in a long time.

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?? opinion. say something, please..

nikbee said:

your "Real" is univeral, no? but the worst kind of universal, its relativist. not every violence is equal, at least i dont think so. you need to think of violence beyond just bludgeoned heads.. im violated all the time by the systematic nihilism of capitalism.. this is violence to me.. the worst kind. worse than the Stalin gulag kind.. at least Stalin was 'honest.' the lines were drawn, i knew what i couldnt do.. period.. and this stupidity led to his downfall.. didnt we learn anything from stoszek?

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Oh for fuck's sake. There's no comparison between the violence Jews suffered under Nazis, for example, and the fact that life isn't perfect for you in every way at all times because you have to live under the state. Get a fucking handle on reality. Your life is actually pretty good. There are people suffering FOR REAL, not just abstractly, right now. I don't feel sorry for you.

Funnily enough, all of this is coming from someone who wants to reify the state.
I'm all for abolishing the state, which IS power, and you're not. How ironic is that?

Now I know you're not Croatian. Nobody who had actually lost their entire family to violenc would be spouting this utter tripe.

nikbee said:

your "Real" is univeral, no? but the worst kind of universal, its relativist. not every violence is equal, at least i dont think so. you need to think of violence beyond just bludgeoned heads.. im violated all the time by the systematic nihilism of capitalism.. this is violence to me.. the worst kind. worse than the Stalin gulag kind.. at least Stalin was 'honest.' the lines were drawn, i knew what i couldnt do.. period.. and this stupidity led to his downfall.. didnt we learn anything from stoszek?

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No, it's not "universal".

For example, sometimes doctors need to amputate to save someone's life. In that case, the violence wasn't just violence, because it sustained life instead of destroying it.

But to try to pretend that it's ok to snuff out someone else's life, more ok than it is to live under the auspices of a state, is just nonsense.

This is why religious and other fundamentalists are the most immoral people on earth.

nomadthethird said:

Good lord the more you talk the deeper you bury yourself in horseshit.

This is the funniest shit that's happened on Dissensus in a long time.

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does their 'politics of the lack' not break the deadlock youre in for example? you just want vicious peace.. i do too. but we're stuck..

really, the act of 'naming the lack' inherent to the system can be a very non violent process..

nomadthethird said:

No, it's not "universal".

For example, sometimes doctors need to amputate to save someone's life. In that case, the violence wasn't just violence, because it sustained life instead of destroying it.

But to try to pretend that it's ok to snuff out someone else's life, more ok than it is to live under the auspices of a state, is just nonsense.

This is why religious and other fundamentalists are the most immoral people on earth.

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this is your example of violence? a doctor amputating a leg? im totally confused.

You make me sick, Nikbee.

People like you are everything that's wrong with the world.

If gulags are so great, why not go back to the Ustase? Let them kill you too?

Why are you in the U.S. right now if it's better to kill or be killed than it is to live as a liberal?

When are you going to overthrow capitalism? Before, or after, your next paycheck?

nikbee said:

does their 'politics of the lack' not break the deadlock youre in for example? you just want vicious peace.. i do too. but we're stuck..

really, the act of 'naming the lack' inherent to the system can be a very non violent process..

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No, I don't want "vicious peace".

I don't particularly want anything, except to change the world for the better whenever and wherever I can.

Utopia doesn't exist. Except in your dreams.

nomadthethird said:

Oh for fuck's sake. There's no comparison between the violence Jews suffered under Nazis, for example, and the fact that life isn't perfect for you in every way at all times because you have to live under the state. Get a fucking handle on reality. Your life is actually pretty good. There are people suffering FOR REAL, not just abstractly, right now. I don't feel sorry for you.

Funnily enough, all of this is coming from someone who wants to reify the state.
I'm all for abolishing the state, which IS power, and you're not. How ironic is that?

Now I know you're not Croatian. Nobody who had actually lost their entire family to violenc would be spouting this utter tripe.

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how can i not call you crazy? the claims you make.. unbelievable..

and youve STILL offered nothing. other than peace as transcendental.

nikbee said:

this is your example of violence? a doctor amputating a leg? im totally confused.

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Violence isn't a word that can be willy-nilly applied to anything in the world that you happen to dislike. Doing so, in the way that many Badiouites do, renders the word so vague and broad as to be completely meaningless.

Violence is the act of physically harming someone else. Sometimes these physical wounds cause psychological harm. But psychological harm is called "damage", not "violence", and they're not identical phenomena.

i need a second opinion!!!.. whered all yall go? am i crazy? is this a joke?

nikbee said:

how can i not call you crazy? the claims you make.. unbelievable..

and youve STILL offered nothing. other than peace as transcendental.

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There is nothing that is transcendental. Nothing.

Peace is not transcendental. I don't believe in "peace" as anything but a situational, temporary, volatile, and infrequent state of affairs that happens on the level of the particular, not the universal.

There will never be universal peace.

nomadthethird said:

Violence isn't a word that can be willy-nilly applied to anything in the world that you happen to dislike. Doing so, in the way that many Badiouites do, renders the word so vague and broad as to be completely meaningless.

Violence is the act of physically harming someone else. Sometimes these physical wounds cause psychological harm. But psychological harm is called "damage", not "violence", and they're not identical phenomena.

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i would rather be physically harmed than live in that awfully awfully nihilistic and cynical head of yours any day..

nikbee said:

i would rather be physically harmed than live in that awfully awfully nihilistic and cynical head of yours any day..

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Good, then do it. Go back to the Ustase.

But I know you won't do that, you're a pussy.

So you'll continue to live under capitalism, taking money from capitalism, allowing it to feed and nourish you, give you a place to live, a shelter from your fascist oppressors, a career, book deals, and still, you'll consider yourself a victim.

Chuckle.

nomadthethird said:

No, I don't want "vicious peace".

I don't particularly want anything, except to change the world for the better whenever and wherever I can.

Utopia doesn't exist. Except in your dreams.

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i mean, this is the most basic question!!! how do we achieve peace? by saying it?

youre entering what you claim to be 'transcendental'.. if peace is your "Real" then accept it, and figure out how to make that Real real. i support this!

nikbee said:

i mean, this is the most basic question!!! how do we achieve peace? by saying it?

youre entering what you claim to be 'transcendental'.. if peace is your "Real" then accept it, and figure out how to make that Real real. i support this!

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I was making fun of your conception of the "Real" as a political proposition. Duh.

The real is not something I have access to, nor do you, except in fragments.