Resistance is Futile.

[shiels]

I enjoy Padraig’s input. I’ve told him that a few times. Our misunderstandings have mainly been about tone. I can sometimes misjudge what’s ok to say to people I barely know, a life long problem, but no harm meant.

 

[Leo]

read the room

 

[pattycakes_]

Fuck the room. Just be ready for it not to go how you expected. Learn and move on.

 

[Leo]

sometimes people are just grumpy. woke up on the wrong side of the bed, as it were. in a mood, hone in on an offhand remark and won't let it go.

 

[luka]

dont worry shiels i think youre a great influence. youve cheered the place up like some union jack bunting

 

[constant escape]

Can such tension/agonisms be harnessed? Turned into some kind of crucible of intoxication, ultimately productive? That is, without merely pitting people against each other.

Can the passion be lured out and strapped into some kind of dialectical mech framework? Vitality coursing through circuit-veins of a thesis-machine?

That said, there doesn't seem to be much radical disagreement between the point of this thread, which largely seems to be about the point of this forum. Just miscommunications, perhaps.

To be sure, I'd only be about fanning flames in the (consensual) interest of generating concepts.

 

[luka]

it's a nice idea. i dont really know what to do about it. it only became a really serious problem quite recently.

 

[luka]

probably best just to let it lie for now

 

[constant escape]

Seconded, ultimately.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

clarification

some things - anti-intellectualism, fascination with conspiratorial thinking - really bum me out

no, people don't literally celebrating ignorance or (I hope) believe in QAnon type nonsense

but we live in a world that is absolutely awash right now in anti-intellectualism and conspiracy thinking

even a pale reflection of that here, I think, make this place actively worse. other people may disagree.

the banter/taking the piss angle - like I don't want to be anti-fun or anti-banter, who does? but peak banter, whatever barty @susan thinks, was way worse than anything on the last couple pages, it lead to multiple people quitting indefinitely/forever.

really, I just want to be able to go to the one place on the Internet I really care about (super dumb, but true) and have it be free of unreality. but it's a collective endeavor, so you don't always get what you individually want.

wrestling with luka (who I like and respect) over reality wearies my bones. under normal non-lockdown circumstances I don't have the energy for it.

nor do I really enjoy it. I don't want to be all "I'm taking my ball and going home" but I probably need to take a break. it's a good idea sometimes.

 

[luka]

peak banter was my favourite period in the history of the forum. It's the only time I've really enjoyed the place.

 

[luka]

as I was saying earlier there's always a perpetual struggle over what this place should be and how it should work. Barty single handededly revived the forum and a small number of people want to pretend he was somehow an evil monster. Which I find a bit odd really. I don't think anyone is being disengenous, we just have a huge disconnect somewhere.

 

[luka]

I think it's a shame but it seems to be inevitable. Barty has left for good because of how horrible a lot of people were being to him. He just got ground down by it.

 

[luka]

What I really value is both banter and making stuff up. So peak banter was also the time of feminine pressure, time barrier, dematerialisation, etc etc. By far and away the most creatively fecund and energised period in the history of the forum. The only time the forum has begun to live up to its potential.

 

[luka]

I don't want to refight old battles but that needs reaffirming

 

[constant escape]

Is any prevalence in anti-intellectualism merely a (misguided?) byproduct of an increasing disillusionment/disappointment with the capabilities of establishments? For so long I viewed school/college/university as bleak, ineffectual and useless, and thus I considered a wide range of topics to be of little value. Maybe any anti-intellectual trend makes the same error: conflating the topics with their presentation/handling. (Edit: rather, conflating the (apolitical?) methodology of the intellect with the politics of the academic elite that have the deepest claim in the intellect?)

If the academy (broadly speaking) has, in effect, a pseudo-monopoly or a bottleneck toll on the intellect, it makes sense that non-academics (again broadly speaking) would be inclined to oppose the intellect, no?

I'm not arguing that the reasoning is valid, but I am arguing that its an understandable conflation to make, given the way we make associations.

Similar to how someone, who is against monopolies, might have some kind of aversion to princesses because of Disney. Seeing as, I would assume (which is perhaps a misstep), much of the anti-intellectualism proper (as in conspiracy theories) seems to be coming from the crowds that oppose the academic elite (for reasons largely extraneous to intellectualism), it makes sense that they would also oppose the thing that the academic elite have (whatever degree of a) monopoly on: the intellect. The intellect, and, by extension: scientific method, logic, criticism, etc.

Sorry for that mess of a sentence.

 

[luka]

what I meant by anti intellectualism was making things up. Coming up with ideas, articulating things for yourself, epiphanies, brainstorms, mad leaps, strange connections, without any appeals to authority or referencing of boring dead people.

 

[luka]

Having fun in other words. Thinking as intoxication. Not as something learned memorised regurgitated

 

[luka]

the fact is Barty is a hugely generous person and put the rest of us to shame in terms of the effort and energy he put into this place and how much praise and encouragement he gave the rest of us. He really drove himself into the ground for us. He wanted to get the best out of everyone. I wish everyone was like him

 

[luka]

The fact that he was asked to write a book and given a large advance to do so solely on the basis of the quality of his posts here says it all. That would never happen to anyone else here in a million years, let's face it.