2013 > 013 > 130

[tom lea]

Wheres the riddims at no more theory from Benny B please

on my phone but i'm guessing these are mostly on soundcloud etc

rabit - double dragon ep
samename - mishima curse, kastform, devil eyes
compa - 3 series, we go, feed forward
walter ego - military mind
kid d - apocalypse
slackk - shogun assassin

i mean these are mostly 140bpm beats and i dunno if anyone was referencing their nuum wallchart while writing em but they all bang.

 

[Vic Serotonin]

Some highlights from the last Dusk + Blackdown:

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[huffafc]

thanks said and vic!
yeah, vic, i think there is definitely a parallel between Beneath and Burial, as well. both finding a previous moment that is productively out of sync with the present, that demonstrates that the present is not a necessity. and, as you say, using these previous moments not simply as something to be hallowed, but as a set of resources and perhaps an ethic, promise, culture to carry on.

i also see them as marking out two roughly separate stages in the - with burial you have music as mourning, reminding you of the absence of what it references. within the whole hauntological program, part of the challenge is to create emotional immediacy through an experience of distance.

what's interesting about beneath, and a lot of these 130/keysound artists, is that this is music grounded in certain recovered past moments, but they aren't heard as nearly lost in the airwaves. instead, these guys are trying to pick up a story, a project, (the dread, darkness of 00's dubstep and grime) that never finished up and can twist more recent things like funky or post-dubstep into new forms that seem to carry that story on.

or very briefly: burial/lost utopia vs beneath(130etc)/unfinished story

also i like this slithery, slightly unnerving beneath remix of photek (don't think anyone's posted it yet):
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[NKC]

thanks said and vic!
yeah, vic, i think there is definitely a parallel between Beneath and Burial, as well. both finding a previous moment that is productively out of sync with the present, that demonstrates that the present is not a necessity. and, as you say, using these previous moments not simply as something to be hallowed, but as a set of resources and perhaps an ethic, promise, culture to carry on.

i also see them as marking out two roughly separate stages in the - with burial you have music as mourning, reminding you of the absence of what it references. within the whole hauntological program, part of the challenge is to create emotional immediacy through an experience of distance.

what's interesting about beneath, and a lot of these 130/keysound artists, is that this is music grounded in certain recovered past moments, but they aren't heard as nearly lost in the airwaves. instead, these guys are trying to pick up a story, a project, (the dread, darkness of 00's dubstep and grime) that never finished up and can twist more recent things like funky or post-dubstep into new forms that seem to carry that story on.

or very briefly: burial/lost utopia vs beneath(130etc)/unfinished story

this is something i been thinkin about quite a bit recently, in a really really similar way.
to take it off topic and a bit more bait, i started thinkin about it after bok bok's southside ep got released - 'southside' referencing the grime label, Reminder being a remake of a youngstar tune, silo pass sampling dizzee's Go. if you read bok bok's interviews, he talks about the UK thing in definite opposition to the more popular euro stuff. i was looking at mosca's done me wrong and bax as well - done me wrong samples AVH's remix of cj bolland, bax is supposedly named after the owner (or someone like that?) of niche. for the kind of nights i was going to, these were probably the 2 biggest tunes in the clubs in 2011, and they both continue respective sounds with overt references to tracks made 10 years or so earlier. kahn and neek's percy might come into it too. as you say it's not "haunting" enough to fit in with the hauntology stuff, and i'd like to think there's more to it than just like a postmodern nostalgia mode.
but these examples maybe don't fit as well as this 130 stuff does, because mosca jumps ship every release, and bok bok's turned mainly to techno stuff now. they're obviously not within this scene or anythin either, im just makin the point that this rejection of the present in favour of building on an old story has been present in the more obvious places of some recent uk stuff too. lookin forward to checkin the mixes and if there's any more along the lines of what Crary is sayin about rejection of present i'd be interested to be pointed in tht direction

 

[CrowleyHead]

Well, to throw in some more details towards "Percy" as an example, I am a dork enough that I bought the Gorgon Sound Grime Mixtape they put out, and as I was playing the tape, I realize I was buying fake grime nostalgia as many of the segments were youtube rips. I was literally going over in my head "This is from grimetapes... This is from youtube... This is that Wiley EPK thing, fuck." It was fine, because I wanted to hear grime at cassette speed/tone anyway, which I might not get to until I can afford to go into total Fanboy mode and buy those off eBay, but if anything, this product is more of an example of the Kahn & Neek nostalgia moreso than even their own tunes.

 

[NKC]

Well, to throw in some more details towards "Percy" as an example, I am a dork enough that I bought the Gorgon Sound Grime Mixtape they put out, and as I was playing the tape, I realize I was buying fake grime nostalgia as many of the segments were youtube rips. I was literally going over in my head "This is from grimetapes... This is from youtube... This is that Wiley EPK thing, fuck." It was fine, because I wanted to hear grime at cassette speed/tone anyway, which I might not get to until I can afford to go into total Fanboy mode and buy those off eBay, but if anything, this product is more of an example of the Kahn & Neek nostalgia moreso than even their own tunes.

yeh, well that tape thing for me is the point where it seems to go from like a potential comment on/resistance to current culture to a more problematic case of someone making money from somethin they werent really part of.. which is the way it sorta seems with mosca because of how he doesn't stick at a particular sound

 

[huffafc]

im just makin the point that this rejection of the present in favour of building on an old story has been present in the more obvious places of some recent uk stuff too.

definitely, i'd say what i'll call alternative-history music - like bok bok or kahn and neek making grime from an alternative timeline 2004 - is pretty pervasive in uk dance music. (and it's not an inherently bad thing - just a common way of working today.) the line between a one-off reference and a deep dedication to carry on the promise/drive/etc of a past movement is very blurry.

there's two kinds of dangers that I see - on the one hand, there's straight revivalism or nostalgia (you know, basically anything that smacks of wynton marsalis). in that case, the music trades on a kind of 'it was better than nostalgia' and/or functioning as a kind of musical comfort food. on the other hand, there's the glib reference, that's also trades on a kind of nostalgia, throwing in some signifiers for an older genre, doing a banal pastiche etc.

it's definitely not the artists the sound the most like the music of their chosen past moment that are the most interesting - i like the fact that facta doesn't 'get it right' - but the ones who manage to find the ways that those past moments are still open-ended, not yet totally determined, spaces, with other routes not yet taken. at their best, that's what these 130 guys seem to have found in early 00's grime/dubstep.

if there's any more along the lines of what Crary is sayin about rejection of present i'd be interested to be pointed in tht direction

Crary's kind of paraphrasing Benjamin there - so definitely Benjamin's essay on Surrealism. It's an idea is present in different ways pretty much across the Frankfurt school - I'd say the best round up of this issue within the work of the Frankfurt crew is Frederic Jameson's Marxism and Form.

 

[Blackdown]

for the record, while i think it's easy to say "oh this references old grime" and "oh that references early dubstep" - like they fit into some convenient trope - what i'm often looking for in tracks to play and release are ones that have values from several of those lineages, such that it becomes hard to say exactly what stops and starts where. (walton cool it VIP for example: eski? funky? bass? house?)

and hence from that mutation/blend, this is where new unique forms come from. i mean people just said "oh early '00s dubstep it's just garage but darker, there's no unique form there" but with enough blending, blurring and mutations there soon was. visionist started out making grime, now i dont know what he makes (in a good way) - but i like it.

i feel we're just at that grow/blend/mutate phase now - and it's exciting.

 

[trilliam]

i feel we're just at that grow/blend/mutate phase now - and it's exciting.

this been going on like three years fam

now its 130
year before 160/watchamacallit/intellistep
year before post dubstep

man r just noodling tbh

 

[Blackdown]

cool cool, this is a marmite thing, this wont be for everyone - that's just fine.

 

[jimitheexploder]

It does seem like its all been building up from about 2007/2008/2009 for me ever since things started to split in the scene more. Its just a natural progression from all of that stuff like... Quarta 330, Joker, Darkstar, Shorstuff, Rustie, Untold, Hessle, Hemlock, Hyperdub. Look at the tracks from those years and beyond and you can easily see the thru lines. Damu and Emma have that Darkstar, Zomby, Samiyam, Rustie, Joker, Desto colourful syrupy thing going on, etc. You can hear the same eski influence at 130 in early Shortstuff, he even sampled Wiley for one. Untold did that house/eski EP on Hemlock with Stop What You're doing on it. But yeah there does seem to be a nice new focus from it of late with Keysound really bringing it together more, there is still a load going on outside of it but Keysound are really building momentum and drawing things together in their own way and its sounding wicked.

 

[jimitheexploder]

On another tip...

Is Damu still making that colourful stuff?

The last 12" was pretty nice but it was on a kind of XXXY, Artifact tip that chunky housey thing. Wasn't quiet as unique as his album or EPs before for me.

 

[tom lea]

The last 12" was pretty nice but it was on a kind of XXXY, Artifact tip that chunky housey thing. Wasn't quiet as unique as his album or EPs before for me.

yeah, he just needs to finish it. there's quite a few vocal collabs in the pipeline.

 

[jimitheexploder]

Sweet

 

[Vic Serotonin]

It does seem like its all been building up from about 2007/2008/2009 for me ever since things started to split in the scene more. Its just a natural progression from all of that stuff like... Quarta 330, Joker, Darkstar, Shorstuff, Rustie, Untold, Hessle, Hemlock, Hyperdub. Look at the tracks from those years and beyond and you can easily see the thru lines. Damu and Emma have that Darkstar, Zomby, Samiyam, Rustie, Joker, Desto colourful syrupy thing going on, etc. You can hear the same eski influence at 130 in early Shortstuff, he even sampled Wiley for one. Untold did that house/eski EP on Hemlock with Stop What You're doing on it. But yeah there does seem to be a nice new focus from it of late with Keysound really bringing it together more, there is still a load going on outside of it but Keysound are really building momentum and drawing things together in their own way and its sounding wicked.

Absolutely, things were already brewing for sure. Pinch (Croydon House), Cooly G (pretty much anything off the Dub Organizer EPs), and Ramadanman/Pearson Sound (Blimey, PLSN/WAD) all jump to mind too. And thanks for pointing out that Shortstuff tune Jim, I hadn't heard it before, it's a beaut.

 

[Blackdown]

Can't forget the whole uk funky wave...

 

[jimitheexploder]

Of course. I mean in 08 you could get quality funky on vinyl even. Pretty sure I've got: Geeneus - Volumes: One, D Malice - The Refix E.P., Roska - The Climate Change EP, DJ NG Feat. Katy B & MC Versatile - Tell Me, Hard House Banton - Siren EP, Apple (6) - Siegalizer, Lil Silva - Seasons / Funky Flex, Mentor Roska* - Feeline / Boxed In, Roska - Elevated Levels, Perempay & Dee - Buss It / Hypnotic, Kode9 vs. LD* - Bad / 2 Bad. All from 08. And most of that is pretty dark too. Dark funky has always been there, I think people get to caught up in the breezyness of some of it to realise that a lot of the best early stuff was real dark and tuff.

 

[trilliam]

Of course. I mean in 08 you could get quality funky on vinyl even. Pretty sure I've got: Geeneus - Volumes: One, D Malice - The Refix E.P., Roska - The Climate Change EP, DJ NG Feat. Katy B & MC Versatile - Tell Me, Hard House Banton - Siren EP, Apple (6) - Siegalizer, Lil Silva - Seasons / Funky Flex, Mentor Roska* - Feeline / Boxed In, Roska - Elevated Levels, Perempay & Dee - Buss It / Hypnotic, Kode9 vs. LD* - Bad / 2 Bad. All from 08. And most of that is pretty dark too. Dark funky has always been there, I think people get to caught up in the breezyness of some of it to realise that a lot of the best early stuff was real dark and tuff.

this one


THIS ONE..

theres a very big difference between say hardhouse banton reign and beneath

 

[jimitheexploder]

Buss It is too good.

There is a difference yeah. But not much of a jump from the grimy strings of D Malice and Apple or the grimy bleeps of Lil Silva. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to add a load of spaced out sub bass and flip the energy a little or techno it up a bit like Kowton has done. Cooly G kind of sits in the middle of the two strians with ease. It aint much of a jump at all in sound. If there was much pure funky going on anymore some of it might get plays there. Bad did at the time, Citizen Dub by Bok Bok did at the time, Claptrap by Joe did a little later on. Plus all that 08 funky is really dark and raw when played next to like proper house music. Playing it at the time in clubs when people didn't know much about it outside of London, people thought you where playing grime or dubstep not a hosue music variant.

 

[Webstarr]

I think some of the stuff we released on Forefront last year falls into this category, particularly the Grievous Angel 12"