Ego

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sadmanbarty

Well-known member
well it's useful to know that's been the cause of the grievance (though i wan't even using the forum when that all transpired).

hope you too can chat it out in private messages and that'll be the end of this sorry saga.
 
luka

luka

Well-known member
pattycakes_ said:
in the rothschilds discussion we had in the conspiracy thread. i riled up the forum. i was trying to ask questions i was curious about. when it all blew up, you were there adding fuel to the fire. which led us to fighting and then you disappearing for a bit
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That is not how I understood that situation patty.
 
pattycakes_

pattycakes_

Can turn naughty
sadmanbarty said:
well it's useful to know that's been the cause of the grievance (though i wan't even using the forum when that all transpired).

hope you too can chat it out in private messages and that'll be the end of this sorry saga.
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this has nothing to do with you
 
shiels

shiels

_
There is something that pattycakes wants and we need to give him space to ask for it. What is it you want pattycakes?
 
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sadmanbarty

Well-known member
i think we're going to weather this storm though. we've circumvented a huge blowout. better bloody not, i've got fuck all to do at the best of times, let alone during a quarantine.
 
pattycakes_

pattycakes_

Can turn naughty
luka said:
You wouldn't believe me anyway because you assume I am always acting in bad faith. And that puts me in a tremendously difficult situation. There's no way to wriggle out.
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luka said:
Whatever patty says I think it's obvious if you read what's been said that he brought up the Rothschilds not because he is interested in them as a symbol or in the emotional response they provoke (though he might also be interested in those things) but because he seriously entertains the idea that they rule the world or that they are part of a cabal of eight families which rule the world.
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luka said:
Yes, he did. In bringing up the Rothschilds he was testing the waters. Is this something dissensus is open to? He found that it wasn't, and he wanted to pull back. He felt hounded. Not even the nutters are into the Rothschild stuff.
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.
 
luka

luka

Well-known member
For what it's worth what I was trying to do on the Rothschilds thread was to say

1. Yes, it is an anti Semitic trope and we need to tread carefully
2. I don't think Patty is anti-Semitic
3. I also think it is possible to have a conversation about it, as Sufi suggested we should.

There was a lot of pressure coming from Droid and Eden, which I'm not criticising them for, it came from a good place, but I was trying to shield you from that while at the same time not shying away from the fact that the Rothschild stuff is inherently dodgy.

What I thought was important was to assume you were acting in good faith and to affirm that. But part of that assumption was also to assume you had displayed poor judgement, or a lack of discrimination, or a surfeit of credulity. Which is, in itself, somewhat insulting. I understand that but that was how I felt and that is what I said.

I'm hugely sympathetic to the lure of conspiracy theory. I'm not judgemental about people whose intuitions lead them up those paths. I understand it. I share it. I'm always getting told off by people here about that which is why I wanted to stick up for you.

I'm not your enemy. I don't want to undermine you or humiliate you.
 
luka

luka

Well-known member
Now clearly I made a complete balls up of that. But that is what my intentions were.
 
V

version

Well-known member
shiels said:
I remember when I was probably seven or eight and my older sisters had her mates around and I’d be excited and playful and she’d cut me with that one... STOP SHOWING OFF. There’s no defence against it. It’s a balance though isn’t it. You can tell the ones who never were told to stfu
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The response is to tell them to "get on my level".
 
luka

luka

Well-known member
But yeah, as those quotes demonstrate, my assumption was that you seriously entertained the idea that the Rothschilds were part,of a consortium of 8 families that rule the world. That seemed obvious to me from the context of the discussion and what you were saying. If I was wrong about that, a thousand apologies.

But you wanted to talk about it so I assumed these were notions you entertained. I wasn't trying to get you into trouble because I Know how those ideas exert their force. I know how compelling they are. They're like magic. And both of us have a strong sense of inuition which often threatens to override our rational responses. That is what we have in common. Mild schizophrenia is what I was told by the official people when I was young and I think you said you got told the same thing?
 
luka

luka

Well-known member
I think the challenge for people like us to be able to honour our intuitions and give them the weight and consideration they deserve while at the same time acknowledging the pitfalls and dangers they present.

Not to discount them in favour of some mythical rationality, but treat them as another source of data, another feed, and kind of match those feeds up and try and establish a consistent world view.
 
shiels

shiels

_
another feed... That's mindfulness isn't it. I hate the word, we need a better word for it. its too bound up in this sanitised tranquility but what you said there about data sources is important, trying to look at your perceptions and reactions as some amongst many, contingency, and accepting and being curious about the filth and cringeworthy stuff, the insecurities etc to understand where they come from and also get a bit of distance from them. Not to get to some pure understanding of yourself but to disentangle from restrictive identities and free up some space
 
luka

luka

Well-known member
I called my second to last big poem the feed I thought it sounded really cool computers and stuff
 
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