Election 2020

[IdleRich]

outdoors with masks is pretty safe though, right? give us some stats, @mixed_biscuits

Selectively picking your statisticians there Leo... sneaky, I like it.
I'm sure Biscuits will tell you that (despite the personal disaster he faces with Trump being cheated out of the election) there is no need to wear a mask in this kind of circumstance. In fact now that herd immunity has kicked in, as long as the ratio of mask wearers to non-maskers is below M (the Mixed Biscuits quotient) this gathering will most likely bring a few people back to life if anything.

 

[mixed_biscuits]

On the one hand, Biden means the end of the world's covid obsession; on the other, he shares Boris' 'Build Back Better' World Economic Forum slogan and will not stand in the way of the new globally fascist age - win some; lose some.

 

[version]

It's not just about whether or not it'll spread the virus. It's the double standard. I understand why people are doing it, but you can't hammer others for being reckless and not taking it seriously then just run out into the street and start having huge gatherings when your guy wins. It completely undermines your argument.

 

[version]

I was just reflecting on how these next few months are gonna be a disaster in terms of the pandemic. I really don't see Trump giving any thought to it at all. Imagine a different world where the president was a decent man who might think that it was more important to stop people dying than scheming about how to cheat his way into staying in power. Ironically, after Trump said that no-one will be thinking of covid after Nov 3rd, it feels from here that the person that will be most true of himself.
Obviously can't do anything about it at the moment - in a sane world there would be some kind of joint task force with a plan for a smooth transition but obviously political concerns that would be admitting defeat will, er, trump that kind of sense.
So I really foresee months of literally nothing been done and then a new team coming in and having to learn it all from scratch, so I imagine that their effectiveness will be severely curtailed to start with.

Apparently Biden's announcing a COVID task force tomorrow.

President-elect Joe Biden announces Covid task force

Biden will not be sworn into office until Jan. 20, when epidemiologists and medical experts say the country could be in a dire situation with the pandemic.

www.cnbc.com

I've also heard he's been lining up appointments and vetting people for a while now due to how understaffed the Trump White House is, so it looks as though he's planning to hit the ground running.

 

[martin]

It's not just about whether or not it'll spread the virus. It's the double standard. I understand why people are doing it, but you can't hammer others for being reckless and not taking it seriously then just run out into the street and start having huge gatherings when your guy wins. It completely undermines your argument.

What pissed me off over summer were the chiefs on Twitter who spent weeks blasting the plebs for going to the pub back in July - OMG you POS, can't you go a month without your pints - before informing everyone how excited they were that their favourite restaurants were reopening on Friday.

Mind you, I'm not talking from a position of superiority; if a family member had become really ill and I thought I wouldn't get the chance to see them again, I'd seriously consider breaking the rules. The Barnard Castle/Specsavers fiasco killed most doubts on that one.

What gets me about stuff like going out to dance in the street without masks, though, is wouldn't you want people on your side to stay safe?

 

[IdleRich]

I've just been reading about an anti-mask parade in London for which they - rather brilliantly - asked attendees to wear the V for Vendetta er masks.
But yeah @martin surely there's no doubt that the Barnards Castle thing gave people justification to change their behaviour and did cause people to actually do so - despite the government's dishonest denials.

 

[Leo]

I must be missing something here because the vast (vast) majority of people I've seen out celebrating are 1) outdoors and 2) wearing a mask. yes, I know, staying home and away from crowds is what we should be doing, but being outdoors for a few hours WHILE WEARING A MASK isn't highly reckless, is it?

 

[Leo]

It's not just about whether or not it'll spread the virus. It's the double standard. I understand why people are doing it, but you can't hammer others for being reckless and not taking it seriously then just run out into the street and start having huge gatherings when your guy wins. It completely undermines your argument.

trump's rallies were reckless because barely anyone wore masks, big difference.

 

[version]

If staying home and away from crowds is what we should be doing then yeah, it is reckless. We still don't even know how effective masks are.

 

[mixed_biscuits]

This mask thing is ridiculous.

a) The government's guidelines themselves say that masks are pretty much useless.
b) There are so many countries that instituted universal mask wear only to be shafted by large increases in cases subsequently. Our cases decreased to practically nothing while no-one was wearing them.
c) We know that once you touch them they have to be changed but practically no-one does this
d) The virus is TINY and there are spaces in the mask and around the edge, through which particles escape.
e) Oxford Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine say that cloth masks _increase_ the risk of infection!

If I spend too much time too close to a coworker who then tests positive, I have to isolate. Does wearing a mask change whether I have to isolate or for how long? The government says no! What does that tell you?

The most ridiculous thing is that no-one wears proper antiviral masks - with goggles - that would actually work.

PS. There are people who are properly wary of the virus: they are either waiting it out at home or they venture out after dark in mask, glasses and gloves, do their shopping double-quick and then scuttle back to safety - I have spotted some of these people and understand that they are honestly taking as many precautions as they can, rather than sporting just one precaution as a badge of moral superiority.

 

[Leo]

well, it appears I've misunderstood things this entire year, then. being outdoors with masks has always been allowed here, aside from the weeks we were in actual lockdown.

 

[Leo]

ok, let's not turn this into a COVID thread, I am apparently wrong and stand corrected.

back to the election

 

[version]

well, it appears I've misunderstood things this entire year, then. being outdoors with masks has always been allowed here, aside from the weeks we were in actual lockdown.

You're conflating being outdoors and taking part in large gatherings.

 

[version]

The Tories are really scrambling now. Apparently both Biden and Harris dislike Johnson due to his sucking up to Trump and comments about Obama, plus the Tories' treatment of NI.

 

[IdleRich]

I must be missing something here because the vast (vast) majority of people I've seen out celebrating are 1) outdoors and 2) wearing a mask. yes, I know, staying home and away from crowds is what we should be doing, but being outdoors for a few hours WHILE WEARING A MASK isn't highly reckless, is it?

I haven't really observed myself to be honest. I got the impression from people's comments above that there were large celebrations with people without masks which - if true - is obviously not great. If they are wearing masks then it obviously mitigates it somewhat.
So yeah I don't really know what has been happening - I was really saying that however happy people are that the witch is dead it doesn't mean that they can go and do a 50,000 person naked clusterfuck for one day. But I haven't personally seen such things happening so....

 

[IdleRich]

ok, let's not turn this into a COVID thread,

Yeah agreed on that... I mean it's relevant to discuss to what extent Trump will abandon such efforts as he is making to control the virus and how much Biden will be able to hit the ground running in the circumstances... but I really don't want to get into the Mixed Up Biscuits craziness stuff again in this thread when we've already got one dedicated to it.

The Tories are really scrambling now. Apparently both Biden and Harris dislike Johnson due to his sucking up to Trump and comments about Obama, plus the Tories' treatment of NI

And also cos he's a colossal dickhead I imagine.
But yeah has he said anything to congratulate them yet? I haven't seen that anywhere.

 

[Leo]

World leaders congratulate Biden on election victory

• Even leaders who built strong relationships with Trump, like U.K. Prime Minister Boris Johnson and Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi, quickly congratulated Biden.

 

[IdleRich]

OK thanks. Hope it choked him having to say that.

 

[IdleRich]

OK, so what's happening here?

This week, GoFundMe quickly pulled the plug on a popular campaign that had raised more than $200,000 to investigate unsubstantiated claims of voter fraud in the 2020 presidential election.
The fundraiser launched on Thursday—a day in which the country was still pretty jittery because the election hadn’t been called yet—and claimed to want to investigate supposed voter fraud in several battleground states, including Arizona, Georgia, Michigan and Pennsylvania, according to Mashable. The outlet reported that on Friday, the campaign had raised at least $219,305 of its $250,000 goal from roughly 3,700 donors.
“This fundraiser attempts to spread misleading information about the election and has been removed from the platform. All donors have been fully refunded,” the spokesperson said.
The effort was launched by Matt Braynard, a former member of Trump’s campaign data team. At the time of publication of this blog, Braynard had moved the effort to GiveSendGo, a free Christian crowdfunding platform. His “Voter Fraud Investigation Fund” fundraiser had raised more than $270,000 of its $500,000 goal from more than 4,000 donors.

I don't see that they're suggesting that the money won't get used to investigate the so-called fraud... so why can't idiots waste their money on that if they want to?
The argument - as far as I can make out- seems to be that allowing it to stand in itself would be some kind of tacit legitimising of the claim about the existence of fraud. Of course it is their platform and they can do what they want but it's gonna add to feelings of persecution from the media that these whackadoodles already have. I assume if I raised a load of money to look for the Loch Ness monster then that would be fine as I spent the money on a submarine and went pootling around the loch wouldn't it? What's the difference here?

 

[Mr. Tea]

This mask thing is ridiculous.

a) The government's guidelines themselves say that masks are pretty much useless.
b) There are so many countries that instituted universal mask wear only to be shafted by large increases in cases subsequently. Our cases decreased to practically nothing while no-one was wearing them.
c) We know that once you touch them they have to be changed but practically no-one does this
d) The virus is TINY and there are spaces in the mask and around the edge, through which particles escape.
e) Oxford Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine say that cloth masks _increase_ the risk of infection!

If I spend too much time too close to a coworker who then tests positive, I have to isolate. Does wearing a mask change whether I have to isolate or for how long? The government says no! What does that tell you?

The most ridiculous thing is that no-one wears proper antiviral masks - with goggles - that would actually work.

PS. There are people who are properly wary of the virus: they are either waiting it out at home or they venture out after dark in mask, glasses and gloves, do their shopping double-quick and then scuttle back to safety - I have spotted some of these people and understand that they are honestly taking as many precautions as they can, rather than sporting just one precaution as a badge of moral superiority.

Oh for heaven's sake, you're not seriously going with this "viruses can pass through the mask" nonsense, are you?

An infected person does not breathe out bare viruses as little isolated particles. They're embedded in droplets of saliva or snot that are orders of magnitude larger, and can easily be stopped by a tightly woven cloth.

Come on man, this is just embarrassing.