The Republican War on Transgender People, Drag Queens, and Queerness in General

mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

_________________________
other_life said:
nice argument. unfortunately ive already drawn me as the heroic and suave dr. reich and you as the conniving and neurotic anna freud
Click to expand...
I don't even think the small motley crew of zealots on this thread have actually specified any particular position. From what ages do you think children should be subject to gender reassigning:

a) surgical procedures
b) hormonal treatments

?
 
other_life

other_life

bioconfused
age of majority for a) but as soon as onset of puberty, articulation of distress over being interpellated as gendered and discomfort with sexed embodiment, and identification with transsexuals as a subculture/tribe (which we are) coincide for b).
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
mixed_biscuits said:
Firstly, most children desist if allowed to proceed into puberty and, secondly, how on earth do you think that statistic is not massaged seeing as sex reassignment surgery is imperfect and incomplete given today's technology, and tends to leave people with major dysfunction and various dependencies.
Click to expand...
"I don't like this number, therefore it's been made up."

Some solid scientific thinking there, professor.
 
other_life

other_life

bioconfused
one out of three of the above preconditions should be enough to begin consultation with a qualified endocrinologist and/or a character analyst who is working with the patient in good faith, with the main goal of easing the patient's mind and showing them that they have options and time
 
subvert47

subvert47

I don't fight, I run away
mixed_biscuits said:
You're not actually arguing for the procedures now considered harmful
Click to expand...

You're making a big jump with "harmful" there. The report claims rather that there isn't evidence to justify them – and that's because Cass ruled out all the evidence.

mixed_biscuits said:
@subvert47 be honest here, do you think this sounds like anything other than the fever dream of a paranoid lunatic fringe to anyone other than that lunatic fringe?
Click to expand...

It's just academese. That's how academics write. It always reads like drivel if you don't know what they're talking about. But anyway... The relevant part re the evidence is section 4.
 
mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

_________________________
other_life said:
age of majority for a) but as soon as onset of puberty, articulation of distress over being interpellated as gendered and discomfort with sexed embodiment, and identification with transsexuals as a subculture/tribe (which we are) coincide for b).
Click to expand...
OK, then you'd be one of the cowboy operators then. But at least you gave some specifics. Presumably people who'd want earlier dates would call you transphobic but you'd have to deal with that as and when.
 
maxi

maxi

Well-known member
Mr. Tea said:
I don't know whether you've ignored anything I've ever said about anything, or are just striking a pose here, but I am absolutely not part of a 'tribe'. I consider myself progressive in a very non-denominational, Labour-voting, free-range-egg-buying kind of way. I'm to the left of Starmer on every issue but I also take a pretty dim view of Corbyn for several reasons. I find Israel's government repellent but I also think Roger Waters is a racist wanker. And so on and so on.

With regards to the issues in this thread, I think you're so far to one extreme that, from your vantage point, everyone looks like they're at the opposite extreme. Which is just not true at all. For instance I think there's a very good case for keeping women's competitive sports for cis women only, and there are parts of the internet where that will earn you opprobrium of the Literally Worse That Hitler variety.

With the therapy issue, I think S47 is correct to identify 'concern trolling' as what's going on here. It's all "Won't somebody think of the children?!", but what you're refusing to do is listen to trans people themselves, who are after all the people being affected by all this. And the regret rate for sex-reassignment surgery is remarkably low, about 1% - much lower than the regret rate for other, less controversial surgeries, such as elective mastectomies for women at high risk of breast cancer. Never mind the fact that most forms of gender therapy are much less drastic than full surgery, and usually consist of hormone therapy, which is to a large extent reversible if the subject changes their mind.
Click to expand...
I said your question speaks to that tribalism issue, not that you are part of a tribe. I'm not personalising this or making assumptions about what you think. You could offer me the same courtesy rather than asserting that I'm "refusing to listen to trans people."

I'm not refusing to listen to anyone, we just disagree. Also, trans people don't all think the same thing. I could just as easily accuse you of not listening to trans people too by treating them as a monolith. I could accuse you of ignoring the minority in a group and siding with the most vocal and prominent side.

How would you respond if someone said you were "refusing to listen to Jews" by not supporting Israeli state crimes? Don't you think that would be a bit ridiculous. Or "hey, Israelis are more affected by this than you so who are you to say what should happen in their country?" In fact, that is something you often do hear from Israel apologists.

They're obviously not the only people affected though, which is the whole issue in the first place. None of what I'm saying is "concern trolling". Again that's just attacking the motive because there's no other argument.

I'm not sure the point you're making about the surgery. I'm not saying people shouldn't be allowed surgery. The 1% statistic is refuted as it happens, you can read about that here https://unherd.com/2023/04/the-media-is-spreading-bad-trans-science/ . But either way it has no bearing on many of the findings of the Cass Review which concern medical malpractice with regard to children.

How do you feel about the Cass Review? subvert said it's a pile of shit from beginning to end or something to that effect. Even the CEO of Mermaids doesn't say that. She said "there are some real positives within the review."

That's the thing now - there are a bunch of people backtracking and pretending they didn't say what they used to say, because the review has forced them into that position, or in the case of those on the sidelines, because it's now a bit safer to do so.

Again, so much of the general response to this is driven by fear and intimidation. "No one wants to get it in the neck" I think Luka said at some point earlier in the thread.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top