Wuhan Killer Sneeze (thanks Tea)

[vimothy]

agemben makes some good points: coronavirus as new pretext for "worst-case scenario" emergency rule, replacing the War on Terror; the "fateful inheritance" of "track and trace" technology and "social distancing" (and the way this strange term instantly appears across the world and enters the everyday lexicon "as if prepared in advance"); the way coronavirus exposes a weak spot in contemporary society.

 

[mixed_biscuits]

christopher caldwell interviews giorgio agemben: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/21/opinion/giorgio-agamben-philosophy-coronavirus.html

argh paywall (

 

[vimothy]

it's not paywalled for me, but you can create free accounts at the NYT I think which allow you to access a certain number of articles a month

 

[vimothy]

also if you google "giorgio agemben philosophy coronavirus" you might be able to avoid the paywall by going via google search instead of direct link

 

[mixed_biscuits]

When I had a flu vaccination a couple of years ago, I was quite surprised to learn how many died of it and wondered what would happen if society decided that it were something that 'shouldn't happen'...virtue-signalling would create a spiral of panic and health and safety would rubber-stamp and formalise the response. It did end up needing a 'novel' flu/cold but the conditions were ripe.

 

[mixed_biscuits]

Makes me think of dematerialisation too: there is a certain biological given to our existence that we accept but anything more impinges on our self-conception as ever-more disembodied entities.

 

[vimothy]

idk I think the threat of coronavirus is quite real - remember all those reports from italy about doctors having to decide which patient gets the respirator and which patient dies? the flu is something which is already managed and part of the normal routine, which makes it a much less likely candidate for emergency response conditions

 

[Mr. Tea]

I'm waiting for when US deaths reach 200k - one minute to midnight on Dec 31st and Mixed Biscuits is the worst kind of fool and everything he has ever said can be disregarded, one minute into 2021 and I take the opposite viewpoint.

Well, their official total is 179,000 (although god knows what the real number is), they've been averaging about 1,000 per day for a while now, there's about 130 days of this year left to go, it's the end of summer and the virus is said to do better in cool weather...

 

[IdleRich]

Are you saying it's already safe to assume that MB is a total fucking dickhead?

 

[WashYourHands]

The lad is delusional, can't concede a single point and seems on the far side of Libertarian thinking. "Wonder if he voted for Brexit?", thought WYH out loud rhetorically.

Unfortunately, this is a lost cause. There's not even a middle ground where the transaction of ideas can gain a foothold. The Tory establishment have fucked things up, again. Shocker. Tell me something new about those cunts. They over-estimate the UK death-rate? Really? Then they drop the figure by 5000 arbitrarily because, because, because of the wonderful things they does.

Maybe a Tory intern, slacking off, stirring the pot, or a Cummings run agent-provocateur getting in your internets abetting cognitive dissonance.

 

[slackk]

agemben makes some good points: coronavirus as new pretext for "worst-case scenario" emergency rule, replacing the War on Terror; the "fateful inheritance" of "track and trace" technology and "social distancing" (and the way this strange term instantly appears across the world and enters the everyday lexicon "as if prepared in advance"); the way coronavirus exposes a weak spot in contemporary society.

Haven't read it yet but I'm pretty sure I read that the social distancing term came from a 50s philosophy about upper classes socialising away from the plebs? I hope that's true and I didn't make it up

 

[mixed_biscuits]

I was right about the overcounting re dropping the death count

 

[IdleRich]

Are you saying it's already safe to assume that MB is a total fucking dickhead?

Your words not mine Ollie. It's totally possible the death rate could come down in the next few days. I make no predictions. I merely observe.

 

[mixed_biscuits]

the flu is something which is already managed and part of the normal routine, which makes it a much less likely candidate for emergency response conditions

Yeah, it's part of the scenery but what if it was decided that it shouldn't be? Flu vaccines are only fractionally effective

 

[mixed_biscuits]

Covid was deemed to merit a crisis response but this then routinely anticipates the 'reasonable worst case' ie. is an overreaction by design

 

[mixed_biscuits]

It's thanks to gov-media blackwashing that everyone against the (right-wing!) gov measures is painted as far right or somesuch nonsense; steering the herd of virtue-signallers really is that easy.

 

[Leo]

notre dame university opened classes in early august. after just two weeks, they've recorded almost 400 cases and shut classes down, moved everything online. same with university of North Carolina, clusters of outbreaks a week or two into the semester and moved online.

MB, that's not the government or media throwing out scare tactics and virtue-signaling propaganda. these are for-profit universities who desperately want to be open in person in order to justify their outlandish tuitions, and even they have given up on trying to push in-person classes.

isn't this evidence that the virus is real and still a threat? how do you explain this, and what would you recommend doing about it?

 

[mixed_biscuits]

Of course it's real but my approach would be to shield the vulnerable, get herd immunity in the general population, then release the vulnerable.

 

[mixed_biscuits]

The stop-start method just delays immunity and gives more time in which the shielding can go wrong.

 

[Leo]

Of course it's real but my approach would be to shield the vulnerable, get herd immunity in the general population, then release the vulnerable.

to clarify, these are all 18-22 year old college students, far from what's considered high-risk individuals. they aren't "vulnerable", yet hundreds of them became sick once the schools are opened.

so let's stick with this specific situation, because it is representative of what businesses and society at large also faces. you're suggesting universities should carry on with in-person classes, allow what will surely be thousands of students to get sick (and in the process, endanger the lives of 60+ year old professors and staff who are higher risk) in order to reach some still-illusive herd immunity?

does that not strike you as perhaps a bit irresponsible? considering how litigious society is today, I'd guess universities would be hit with hundreds of liability lawsuits. what should they do in that case?

I'm pressing on these questions because what you propose appears to be largely theoretical. it might sound conceivable on paper or in a debate, but impractical in the real world.