Going it alone

[boxedjoy]

if you know English and you've listened to a Bowie song you know he can do things with words, and that's all that needa be said

🎶 Ha ha ha
Hee hee hee
I'm the laughing gnome and you can't catch me 🎶

 

[IdleRich]

It's genius "Cut your hair, you look like a Rolling Gnome".

 

[sus]

If you look at someone like Prince, who created their own world and completely inhabited it, someone who seemed driven by their own vision, uncompromising and full of distinct character and urgency, there's no contest.

There was a thread recently about this, where we spoke about how commitment to an aesthetic can be just as or more important than the aesthetic itself, and I think that's the key part of capital-p Pop.

Read literally any bio of Bowie and you know that he "inhabited" characters—not that this kind of procedural deontology matters in comparison with creating worlds that audiences can inhabit. The constant self-reinvention isn't a mark against that, its merely a mark of restlessness and god bless it.

"Driven by their own vision"; "uncompromising"—what the fuck is this, a rockist forum?

 

[luka]

anti-Bowie forum. a little quirk, not programmatic or the consequence of any established dogma

 

[luka]

as soon he died @craner famously did a series of gleeful crowing celebratory posts which some users found in poor taste.

 

[luka]

"Craner, ffs, you're dancing on his grave"

"damn right I am, with my red shoes on"

 

[boxedjoy]

it was Bowie who wanted us to meet him on his rockist terms, not us. He asked us to buy into something he was unable to sell, that's why he's a rubbish popstar.

 

[sus]

There's a difference between not liking the guy's music and resurrecting critical backwaters/reinventing history to diss him.

 

[sus]

Forget why I hang out on this forum full of provincials

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

it was Bowie who wanted us to meet him on his rockist terms, not us

that is correct

 

[IdleRich]

Bowie is the greatest pop star of all time. Utterly false, inhuman looks, ridiculous looks, killer tunes for days in countless styles.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

it's not "anti-Bowie forum"

if anything he has a surprising amount of support compared to what you'd think

I think he's basically trash aside from the odd tune or two

 

[boxedjoy]

but he didn't excel at any of those characters or roles, really: the Space Oddity stuff is turgid and dull, the disco stuff is coercion pomp, it just doesn't land for me at all

 

[IdleRich]

The perfect exemplar of the "genius steals" adage.

 

[luka]

"look at me, look at me, im a laughing gnome, dancing on his grave" Oliver Craner.

 

[IdleRich]

but he didn't excel at any of those characters or roles, really: the Space Oddity stuff is turgid and dull, the disco stuff is coercion pomp, it just doesn't land for me at all

It's not really disco though is it? I've not really heard it called that much.

 

[IdleRich]

Disco elements but it's pop with a bit of disco... or rock with a bit of disco... or pop with a bit of rock and disco. Like Kylie Minogue, it's not supposed to be Bobby O.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

"a prog rock who guy jumped to disco" as @boxedjoy put it, is a bit harsh but basically correct

with the caveat that "prog" and "disco" weren't really codified at the time

 

[luka]

if he didnt look glamourous it would be obvious his closest musical counterpart is Elton John.

 

[boxedjoy]

the difference is that Kylie never asked you to believe she was anything other than the likable, fun girl-next-door type.

So if pop is about being convincing and conviction of aesthetics, I think Kylie is better at being a good Kylie than Bowie is at being a good Bowie.