Brexit Day

[luka]

I generally try to avoid sounding like Luka

don't try to fight it

 

[sufi]

The horse must graze where it is tethered
and
If wishes were horses, beggars might ride

 

[john eden]

don't try to fight it

I'm just nudging the thread along, but will stay in my lane

 

[sufi]

Aside from that, this is a great post.

I generally try to avoid sounding like Luka but the whole Brexit escapade showed us abundantly clearly that there is more going on than a series of rational choices that are made by logical people in their own interests.

So I just think repeatedly saying "this is bad" "this doesn't make any sense" won't get you very far. Precisely because it so entrenched and tied up with identity. It could be COVID, it could be Brexit. The supermarket shelves are full or they're not or it doesn't matter.

I'm not saying ignore it, but I do agree that "the brexit horsey has bolted".

We went through this last year, but there are real struggles happening right now about pay and redundancies and the end of furlough and evictions. And there will be more cuts and there will be stuff happening around climate change.

There will be campaigns around these struggles. The way to win these campaigns is to force concessions out of the ruling class. If the rest of us can unite around some achievable goals, we stand a chance of stemming the tide of evil. It is harder to do this if these campaigns fracture into handwringing around who voted for what in the referendum. It just won't work.

If the price of admission to a renters union (for example) is to admit that you were a terrible person for voting for Brexit, then in some areas of the country you are seriously reducing the pool of people who can be members.

yes, the struggle is more tangible and perhaps more effective on the distinct issues, and maybe a path through those issues can lead to destruction of the underlying system (which is deeper than the tories)
but still, rich and I are yearning for an immediate kicking to deliver to the brexiteers.

there will be a horse proverb somewhere to explicate this properly

 

[Leo]

I was about to do a google search for witty expressions related to horses, and then though to myself "what the fuck am I doing with my life?"

 

[sufi]

I was about to do a google search for witty expressions related to horses, and then though to myself "what the fuck am I doing with my life?"

yeah well
The horse that arrives early gets good drinking water.
or possibly
Give a horse to the one who likes the truth so that on it he can escape.

 

[sufi]

I was about to do a google search for witty expressions related to horses, and then though to myself "what the fuck am I doing with my life?"

i just discovered some CBD gummies and as they say in Mongolia You can’t put two saddles on the same horse

seems we're on the next page now anyway so it's time to update the imagery

 

[sufi]

i wonder whether there are ways to exploit the post-brexit issues constructively - like setting up a lorry driver collective and crushing the corporate food chains, establishing our own agricultural networks to distribute locally produced produce
proving some points by making social improvements while also denying the lords of brexit their booty

 

[john eden]

i wonder whether there are ways to exploit the post-brexit issues constructively - like setting up a lorry driver collective and crushing the corporate food chains, establishing our own agricultural networks to distribute locally produced produce
proving some points by making social improvements while also denying the lords of brexit their booty

Yes that all sounds great and is the reason why I support both my local foodbank and local veg box scheme, for example.

 

[john eden]

A comrade is heavily involved with this too https://cooperation.town/

 

[john eden]

I think the COVID-19 mutual aid networks have mainly vanished now or turned into curtain twitching fora but it just shows what can be set up at short notice.

 

[sufi]

A comrade is heavily involved with this too https://cooperation.town/

i have to say your comments in the "let's start a co-op" thread about how co-ops create petty bureaucratic spaces were annoyingly accurate - i've had some boring and unproductive entanglements with co-ops since that conversation where i'd hoped for more egalitarian & inclusive attitudes

 

[sufi]

I think the COVID-19 mutual aid networks have mainly vanished now or turned into curtain twitching fora but it just shows what can be set up at short notice.

sees to be a natural tendency for local whatsapp groups to end up as snitch-ins

 

[IdleRich]

What I find very odd is blithely saying "brexit is over no point discussing it" on the one hand while on the other saying that Afghanistan is a live issue and a groundswell of public opinion may somehow alter US policy... bizarre double standard.

 

[IdleRich]

Oh conversation has moved on while I was driving home...

 

[john eden]

What I find very odd is blithely saying "brexit is over no point discussing it" on the one hand while on the other saying that Afghanistan is a live issue and a groundswell of public opinion may somehow alter US policy... bizarre double standard.

Well I marched against the invasion of Afghanistan and the Iraq war in the noughties.

Unlike some on the left, my main activity these days is not centred on how these military operations were wrong and people were misled into supporting them.

Hiroo Onoda - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[WashYourHands]

 

[IdleRich]

Well I marched against the invasion of Afghanistan and the Iraq war in the noughties.

So did I, but I was talking specifically about the thread right now and Biden.

 

[john eden]

So did I, but I was talking specifically about the thread right now and Biden.

Yes. Talking about the thing right now is good. Fighting old battles is bad.

 

[IdleRich]

I think we have more chance of reversing brexit than US policy.